Transcript for MuggleCast Episode #732, It’s Morfin Time! (HBP Chapter 10, ‘The House of Gaunt’)
Cold Open
Laura: Morfin is just hissing at him, literally, “You’re not welcome here. Get out.”
Eric: Still, if a guy is hissing at me, I’m probably going to back up a little bit.
Micah: You’ve been on the New York City subways too, Eric?
[Andrew and Laura laugh]
Laura: I think if a rando brandishing a bloody knife and a dead snake is hissing at me, I’ve received the message.
Show Intro
[Show music plays]
Andrew Sims: Welcome to MuggleCast, your weekly ride into the world of Harry Potter. I’m Andrew.
Eric Scull: I’m Eric.
Micah Tannenbaum: I’m Micah.
Laura Tee: And I’m Laura.
Andrew: And we’re your Harry Potter friends talking about the books and the movies and the upcoming TV show, so make sure you press that follow button in your favorite podcast app so you never miss an episode. And this week, prepare your best organic door decorations – no snakes, please – because we’re getting ready to visit the Gaunt family in Chapter 10 of Half-Blood Prince, “The House of Gaunt.” And before we get to that, just wanted to let everybody know Audible’s Chamber of Secrets full cast audiobook is out Tuesday, December 16, the day that this episode will be released. Wanted to bring this up because we were very pleasantly surprised by Sorcerer’s Stone, and very much looking forward to Chamber of Secrets and the rest of the series. As a reminder, each book is going to be released on a monthly cadence, so Prisoner of Azkaban will be out in January, Goblet of Fire in February, so on and so forth. With each new book, of course, comes some new characters, so Kit Harington, who you’ll know from Game of Thrones, joins the cast as Gilderoy Lockhart, and Daniel Mays debuts as Dobby. So looking forward to those, and we plan to do a review of the first three audiobooks, and then again once the rest of the series is out in the months ahead.
Micah: Who is Daniel Mays?
Andrew: I don’t know.
Micah: Oh.
Andrew: “Hi, Billy Mays here! And that’s my son.” [laughs] No, uh… yeah, I don’t know.
Laura: I don’t think there’s any family relation there.
Andrew: [laughs] It doesn’t look like it.
Laura: I feel like we’d know that.
Andrew: It is the holiday shopping season, and we have special deals running on our Patreon and over at MuggleCastMerch.com. The Patreon keeps the show running, unlike Marvolo’s iron fist over his decrepit household, and we have our best offer of the year. Get 20% off an annual membership; just visit Patreon.com/MuggleCast, and sign up for an annual subscription at the Dumbledore’s Army or Slug Club level, and this will guarantee you next year’s gift, plus a year of ad-free episodes, bonus episodes, access to our member-only Potter communities, including those monthly Slug Club hangouts, and a lot more. Just use code “HOLIDAY” at checkout. And don’t forget, you can gift memberships as well, or you can receive a gifted membership, so keep that in mind. And second, get 20% off all merchandise at MuggleCastMerch.com. You can get cozy this winter with a MuggleCast hoodie, or beanie, or socks, or Laura’s pants, or a long sleeve tee… and if you live down under, stay cool this summer with a short sleeve tee or crop top. Lots of options. Or some glassware.
Eric: Oooh, love that. We’re now appealing to all seasons of the world. Love that.
Andrew: Yes, I just sent out a Cozy Comfy Combo Pack to somebody in Michigan. The Cozy Comfy Combo Pack includes the beanie and socks. I was like, “Oh, they’re smart. They’re getting ready for winter.”
Eric: Very smart.
Andrew: With the help of MuggleCast. So the deals that we have on MuggleCastMerch.com and Patreon.com/MuggleCast end Friday, December 19, so act now.
Chapter by Chapter: Pensieve
Andrew: All right, time for Chapter by Chapter, Half-Blood Prince Chapter 10, “The House of Gaunt.”
Eric: We’ll begin with our Pensieve segment, as always. We last discussed Chapter 10 of Half-Blood Prince on MuggleCast 390, which was titled “Falling Softly,” and that debuted on October 22, 2018.
Dumbledore: What you are looking at are memories. This is the most important memory I’ve collected. It is from MuggleCast Episode 390.
[Sound of memory uncorking]
[Sound of plunging into Pensieve]
Sam: In this chapter we meet Bob Ogden, and then in Chamber of Secrets, a third of the way in is the first time we hear mention of Ogden’s Old Firewhisky.
Andrew: Oh!
Eric: Is it like his brother invented the whiskey or something?
Sam: Maybe.
Eric: Because Bob Ogden is Head of Magical Law Enforcement. If his brother had a…
Micah: Maybe he went into the Firewhisky business after this incident.
[Andrew and Eric laugh]
Sam: “You need a drink, Bob. I’m going to make you some.”
Eric: “I need a drink,” yeah. [laughs]
Andrew: The drink was a favorite of Lockhart, and he told his second year Defense Against the Dark Arts class that he wouldn’t say no to a bottle for his birthday.
Eric: So he’s actually imploring 12-year-olds to buy him alcohol?
[Andrew and Sam laugh]
Sam: I love Lockhart so much.
Eric: [laughs] Everything is wrong about Lockhart.
[Sound of exiting Pensieve]
Dumbledore: This memory is everything.
Andrew: That was MuggleCast listener and Slug Club supporter Sam on the podcast, by the way.
Laura: Great throwback.
Chapter by Chapter: Main Discussion
Laura: Well, picking up with this chapter and kind of looking back at last week, I wanted to first ask if we could revisit the debate that we had last week about whether or not Harry was being an ethical student in using the Half-Blood Prince’s instructions to pass off a level of prowess at Potions that he doesn’t really have, and it’s because the very beginning of this chapter calls out that Harry does continue to follow the Half-Blood Prince’s instructions, “with the result that by their fourth lesson Slughorn was raving about Harry’s abilities, saying that he had rarely taught anyone so talented.” So does anyone want to revise their feelings about last week?
Micah: Nope.
Eric: I was going to say, speak now!
Andrew: So I stand by what I said last week, that he should definitely use these notes, use it or lose it. But I think because people are catching on to how talented he is with the book, maybe just admit it. Is it so wrong to admit you’re using these notes?
Eric: If he does, I think maybe the rest of the students won’t take too kindly to it. He would lose the book because it’s not equitable.
Laura: Right, it’s not fair.
Eric: Yeah. The thing about Harry… he does at least offer to allow Hermione and Ron to use the book. This is something that I had forgotten, and it does kind of change a little bit what I was saying last week. Now, I think it’s still unethical to pass that off as his own prowess, and Harry is ultimately not going to learn anything in Potions for another year, so it ain’t great, but he’s not obsessively hoarding it for himself exactly.
Andrew: He’s offering to share the wealth.
Laura: Yeah, sharing is caring. It is deceptive, though.
Eric: Of course, if there were two exact perfect potions, and the two that made them were Harry and Ron, I’m sorry, the other classmates are going to call BS.
[Andrew laughs]
Laura: Well, and Slughorn is just going to look at Ron and be like, “Who are you again?”
Andrew: Hey, but remember, Ron is a very smart character…
Laura: He is!
Andrew: … as the books remind us, unlike the movies.
Eric: Remember, he’s also Slughorn’s favorite, a pure-blood wizard.
Micah: Yeah. I mean, he’s so smart, he can’t even read the writing in the book.
Eric: Oh.
[Andrew laughs]
Laura: Right.
Andrew: It’s chicken scratch.
Laura: I’m so glad you brought that up, Micah, because that is another point we get into early in this chapter, which is the beginning of the bread-crumbing of the plot line of what’s the identity of the Half-Blood Prince? Who is it? And the trio definitely have their suspicions. Ron, of course, as you noted, can barely read the handwriting, which is interesting because Hermione thinks that it looks like a girl’s handwriting, but then Harry is like, “That’s stupid. How many girls are princes, Hermione?”
Andrew: “Duh.”
Laura: So it’s interesting how this plays out, because everybody kind of, I think, makes the most obvious assumptions, when a clear, obvious assumption that should be right in front of them is that this is one of their professor’s handwriting, who they’ve been in class with for the last five years. Presumably Snape has written on the chalkboard, presumably he’s written notes on their assignments, and they could very easily say, “Wow, this looks familiar,” but they don’t.
Andrew: “Could it look like our former Potions teacher book?” That’s another key clue for them to think about. [laughs] “I’ve seen this handwriting in another Potions class. Hmm.”
Eric: I usually tend to think of girls’ handwriting as being nicer and neater than boys’. Do you guys have that same opinion?
Andrew: I do.
Laura: Hmm…
Eric: Just in the most sense?
Laura: Have y’all seen my handwriting?
Eric: No.
Laura: My handwriting is not great.
[Andrew laughs]
Eric: Okay, okay, that’s interesting.
Laura: It’s not terrible, but I will say I think Micah has much neater handwriting than I do.
Eric: Huh. Well, the reason I bring that up is I think that what we are to make of these assumptions – I really love the way you said that, Laura, where everyone kind of goes to the easiest assumption – but I think the reason that Hermione thinks it’s a girl’s handwriting actually just underscores the connection where the Prince is a Prince through his mom. So Eileen Prince is Snape’s mom; that’s the Prince in the Half-Blood Prince, is a woman, so I think maybe that’s the only connection I can make sense of, as far as why she would think that way, or why that’s written that way.
Andrew: In a way, it is a bit of foreshadowing.
[Foreshadowing sound effect plays]
Micah: It’s also a bit ironic that Ron is commenting on… or Ron can’t read the handwriting, but he so easily reads Hermione’s handwriting when he’s copying her notes all the time…
[Andrew laughs]
Micah: … or copying her assignment or paper or what have you, so… I don’t know.
Eric: Yeah, it’s interesting because I think, too, if Harry were really dedicated… it’s not really shade on Harry, but if he’s dedicated to giving the access to the book to the best potions to Ron and Hermione, they would take the time in one of their hundreds of free periods this year, and Harry could transcribe and rewrite on Ron’s book all of the same in neater handwriting, or dictate to Ron and he could write in his book, and then they both could have margin copied books.
Laura: I don’t think Ron cares enough to take the time for that.
Eric: About class?
Laura: Yeah, I mean, think about how much time that is. And then Hermione is just standing on principle; she’s like, “Even though these instructions are objectively worse than what you’re using, Harry, I flatly refuse to cheat.” Something else that I thought was interesting, something that stuck out to me about Snape’s handwriting and the identity of the Prince and Snape’s connection to his mother, it makes me wonder if perhaps his handwriting took after his mother’s handwriting because she was the parent that he had admiration and respect for, over his father.
Andrew: You could think about, too, if they were closer, his mom maybe wrote letters to him…
Laura: Right.
Eric: Aww.
Andrew: … so seeing her writing style rubbed off on him, especially if he would reread the letters.
Eric: Yeah, I tend to think of… I think the word that’s most used to describe Snape’s handwriting is “cramped,” and that really just speaks to me to mean kind of claustrophobic, or that you’re confined in a life that you don’t particularly enjoy. Just looking back to the glimpse we got last book of Snape’s home life, it doesn’t seem like a pleasant place to be or grow up, so the cramped writing style, for me, is a natural extension of the really sort of chokingly small leeway that Snape had at home.
Laura: I like that.
Micah: Yeah, he’s definitely crampy. Crabby. Crampy?
[Laura laughs]
Andrew: Crabby, crampy, crappy…
Eric: Crabby, crampy.
Micah: And I like that point, Eric, too, because as we start to go through this chapter, I think there’s a lot of similarities between how a father treats, in this case, his daughter, and how Snape’s father treats his wife. Although we’re not given that context yet about Snape’s family, but the fact that Snape is, via the Half-Blood Prince in this chapter, and we’re talking about Eileen Prince, I think there’s definitely parallels that can be drawn.
Eric: Yeah, and why not throw in, too, the grandfatherly situation between Dumbledore and Harry in this chapter? Because there’s some obfuscation of truth going on.
Micah: Never.
Laura: Yeah, common theme with these two characters. But speaking of Dumbledore, pretty quickly after this interaction with the trio in the common room, Harry has to depart because he has his first lesson with Dumbledore, the lesson that he has no idea what’s going to happen or what to expect. And as Harry is on his way to Dumbledore’s office, he does stumble across Trelawney, and she is reading playing cards and really reading into what she’s drawing, so I thought we could take a moment to just kind of analyze what she draws. So she draws the two of spades, the seven of spades, the ten of spades, and the knave of spades, citing things like conflict, an ill omen, violence, and “a dark young man, possibly troubled, one who dislikes the questioner.” And she very quickly says, “Oh, no, this can’t be right.” But Eric, you actually went in deep here and pulled some readings of what these cards could be in tarot, right?
Eric: Yeah, so many people… or it’s possible that people don’t know this, but the minor arcana in tarot… and playing cards can be used like tarot cards; they’re designed that way. So the numbers and the four suits… for instance, the spades equivalent in tarot is swords. So it’s interesting, because looking up just very helpful, handy websites – in particular, Labyrinthos is the one that I used for this – the findings, or the descriptions on here largely match what Trelawney is reading, and I kind of had a revelation in that when Trelawney is just walking down a corridor at Hogwarts and she’s shuffling these cards and pulling them to gain some level of meaning, I found that a lot of the cards could relate very strongly to Draco and the plot with Draco. All of the cards except the last one, in fact, seem to be very heavy handed on what Draco is doing. And I think this makes sense, because what’s going on at Hogwarts this year, right? It’s Draco’s year. It’s his quest; he’s got to kill the headmaster. And Trelawney, it’s such an interesting thing that she could be cluing into it, if only she could believe her findings.
Andrew: He’s trying to set up an infiltration of Hogwarts, too. Hogwarts, the school led by Dumbledore, to your point. So it is fascinating that Trelawney is pulling these cards while walking by Harry, who is very much tied to Draco’s story.
Eric: Yeah. No, exactly. That’s well said. But yeah, so the two of spades – just going here off of Labyrinthos – “The two of swords symbolizes the confusion we face when we’re forced to make difficult choices. The woman in the card being blindfolded,” which is how it is in the tarot, “is a representation of a situation which prevents her from seeing both the problem and the solution with clarity. The swords that she is holding in each of her hands show that there are two choices that lead in different directions and are mutually exclusive to the other. It may also depict a stalemate, which means the problem should be addressed with a logical and rational thinking.” So there’s this idea also with the two of spades of an illusion of choice, and it’s like the choices that Draco has to make in this year are already made for him in certain ways. His choice is really just whether he can possibly survive and succeed, but the choice to kill Dumbledore is going to outlive Draco, should he fail.
Laura: I love that.
Micah: Could you tie this card at all, though, back to Narcissa and the choice she had to make earlier on in Half-Blood Prince?
Eric: Very much so. Moving to some of the other cards, the seven of spades, from Labyrinthos, says it’s about betrayal and deception. “When you get this card, it may imply that you or someone else in your life is having difficulty getting away with something. There are instances when we are forced to be sneaky, hoping that we will not be discovered. When we are found out, we have to face the consequences.” Is anybody else getting Draco at the Slug Club holiday party?
Andrew and Laura: Yeah.
Andrew: Or even Harry in this moment that Trelawney is pulling these cards is being sneaky.
Eric: Yeah, yeah. So it’s pretty interesting. And Draco’s got a big, big secret that, if it comes out, would be absolutely horrible for him. Even though I guess the relevant parties, his Head of House and the Headmaster, already know it, it’s a big secret. And the ten of spades is violence, according to Trelawney. It indicates a major disaster of some sort; “a certain force of extreme magnitude has come to hit you in your life – one that you may have not foreseen. There is a sense of betrayal that is indicated here, for the character is stabbed in the back.” It’s a reminder that how much we try, we cannot control everything. This kind of foreshadows maybe Harry’s loss, as well as the betrayal of Dumbledore by a student that was supposed to be… that’s not what a student is supposed to do to the Headmaster.
Micah: Or by Snape. I mean, we’re led to believe that Snape is acting of his own accord.
Eric: Yeah. So the one that doesn’t make any sense to Trelawney, and she says, “This can’t be right,” is the knave of spades, which is the page of swords, and this is what I got from that. It says, “When it comes to your career, you may be someone who is intelligent, innovative, and ambitious. You may have lots of energy and many ideas to put into your career. Since this card is a page, this does point to some sort of apprenticeship, or new experience, meaning that you may either be in a period of training, or the start of a new job or career path.” The thing about this is she is closest to Harry here, and all of a sudden, it’s like somebody’s an apprentice and is being trained, which is what Harry is going off to do with Dumbledore.
Andrew: [laughs] Well, it’s very interesting that all these can tie to Harry and Draco. And I also wonder if it dawns on Trelawney that the cards she’s pulling could relate to somebody who is near. She does also say, “Well, that can’t be right” when she’s pulling the last one, I think it is. So she must be thinking about these cards in relation to someone, right? What’s going through her mind?
Eric: Yeah, she’s following a narrative. It’s just so funny, because the potency of these cards – as we’re pointing out, they could relate to some of the major plots of this year – she’s clueless, because she doesn’t know. But she’s got some level of the gift. Her best predictions, her most accurate predictions, she’s doomed to never know how accurate they are.
Andrew: And that’s another thing: This is another example of how Divination is actually sometimes accurate.
Eric and Laura: Yeah.
Micah: But it’s only accurate when she’s stumbling around the castle…
[Andrew laughs]
Micah: … drunk on cooking sherry, pulling cards out of her pocket.
Laura: Listen, that’s how she taps into her inner eye. She’s got to be a little loopy.
Andrew: Well, it makes me think of… a little loopy and a little relaxed. She’s not in front of people; she doesn’t have to perform. She’s just…
Micah: She’s taking the edge off.
Andrew: It reminds me… and I know this is going to sound like a stupid example, but when I’m playing Guitar Hero, if I think too much about hitting the notes in Guitar Hero, I stress myself out, and then I perform badly, whereas if I don’t overthink it, that’s when I’m my best during “Don’t Stop Believing” by Journey, you know?
Eric: No, it’s a great reference. You kind of have to allow muscle memory to take over.
Andrew: Yeah, exactly, right.
Laura: Well, and I think if we’re looking at this as being a commentary on Divination, too, we could also… if we wanted to be critical about Divination, we could also look at this as like, “Here’s another example of how Trelawney really relies on the vagueness of her art form.” Because kind of like we’ve talked about before, if you go and read – and no offense to anyone – but if you go and read your astrological chart for the month, these things tend to be written in such a way that are vague enough that anyone can look into it and find similarities and connections to their own life. Rachel in the Discord is pointing out about the knave of spades connection that Draco is also in training to be a Death Eater in some capacity. I think we could also extend this to connect it to Tom Riddle, even. I think these are vague enough descriptions that we could probably connect them to multiple different characters, which I think is by design to show, “Oh, here’s another example of how Trelawney is kind of closer to the mark than she realizes, but she is not actually expert enough at this to get it right.”
Eric: It’s interesting, though, because Dumbledore has never fostered her gift. If he had just told her what she had done, the reason that she’s at Hogwarts still, if he told her that she was correct, I think a lot of her self-esteem would improve. I think she wouldn’t have to stumble around on cooking sherry, drunk as a skunk all this time. She would have a little bit of confidence. And you know what that would do for somebody like her? I think she would rededicate herself, and I think she would actually become somebody who is a little bit more confident. She would be able to actively make some decisions and discern what’s going on at Hogwarts. Now, again, nobody cares that Draco is trying to kill Dumbledore. Dumbledore knows; Snape is keeping an eye on him. But if she were to hone her gifts a little bit… it’s just a way in which Dumbledore, I think, has failed his staff, because it’s sad that Trelawney… I feel sad when I see this, that Trelawney is so close to something, but…
Micah: It would put McGonagall in her place, too, because she’s been highly critical of Trelawney. And one other apprenticeship that came to mind, too: I know we mentioned Dumbledore and Harry earlier. What about the Half-Blood Prince and Harry?
Laura: Yep.
Eric: [laughs] If only Harry would learn anything, take anything away.
Laura: And see, it’s funny because you could also describe Harry as “possibly troubled”…
Micah: “Possibly.” [laughs]
Laura: … and if you were to think about the Half-Blood Prince being the questioner in this case. Yeah, Harry does dislike Snape. Draco dislikes Dumbledore, if you think about Dumbledore as the questioner. So it really can be applied multiple ways. Well, we are going to go read some tarot of our own, but we’ll be right back after this.
[Ad break]
Laura: So we’re back, and we’re moving ahead to Harry’s first lesson with Dumbledore. And the stage is really set to provide some answers, but with a heaping side of uncertainty, because Dumbledore gives Harry kind of high level confirmation about what they’re working towards without really telling him. So they have this exchange where Dumbledore basically sets him up for what’s going to happen in the next book, when Harry is like, “Does what you’re going to tell me have anything to do with the prophecy? Will it help me survive?” And Dumbledore is like, “It has a very great deal to do with the prophecy, and I certainly hope that it will help you survive.”
Andrew: Yeah. [laughs]
Laura: It’s like, “Come on, man. Stop burying the lead.”
Eric: “If you’re lucky!”
Andrew: Dumbledore is very colorful in this moment, and it’s very interesting to me how Dumbledore admits to Harry that there will be the “wildest guesswork” happening. And since he is “rather cleverer than most men, my mistakes tend to be correspondingly huger.” So he’s like, “I’m going to be guessing a lot, and I could be majorly wrong. But anyway, let’s dive into the memory, and then I’ll share all my crackpot theories.”
Eric: It’s so funny because he’s lying, though, still. I don’t think it’s fair to characterize what Dumbledore is doing right now as guesswork at all, because he has just recently destroyed a second Hor… another Horcrux. So he only ever, at the end of year two, saw the diary, assumed “That’s probably a Horcrux,” but it was gone by the time he got to it. This time, he had a fully functioning Resurrection Stone encased in the Peverell ring that was also holding a Horcrux, managed to destroy it, and how do you know to destroy something? Horcrux destruction is very specific, as the books we find out in the next book say. So Dumbledore knows that it’s Horcruxes; this is not guesswork. And the reason he even says, “Oh, it’s guesswork,” is because Harry actually confronts Dumbledore and says, “Wait a minute, sir. The end of last year, you said you were going to tell me everything!” And he’s like, “So I did.”
Andrew: Maybe is this to ease Harry into it, then? Because dropping some of this with certainty might carry more weight than being like, “Well, it’s just a guess. It’s not the biggest deal. Maybe I’m wrong.”
Eric: Yeah, I can see that being true.
Andrew: And it brings Dumbledore down to Harry’s level, too. It might be more overwhelming if Dumbledore is like, “X, Y, and Z. What do you think, child?” It kind of puts him on his level.
Eric: I agree with that 100%. I think that Dumbledore is making pains to make Harry appear that he’s a peer of Dumbledore’s; he’s treating him like an equal.
Micah: I think us as readers, though, need to go on this journey, because this is part one of several memories that we’re going to visit, and it’s really to kind of peel back the curtain on how Voldemort came to power and how he’s preserving himself and has been for all of these years. If we just kind of got the “He’s making Horcruxes” answer from Dumbledore right in this moment, that’s not as satisfying.
Eric: But think about by the end… if this lesson started with that, which Dumbledore knows, okay? He just knows. Then think where we could have gotten to by the end of this year. Harry would be much further along, there wouldn’t be all this confusion about what he’s really supposed to be doing next year, and Harry probably would have gotten the story of what happened to Dumbledore’s hand, which he never does in the end, even though it’s clued at in this chapter.
Micah: Well, he gets it in Deathly Hallows.
Eric: Through Snape’s memory that he last minute was given before Snape died. It’s so off chance.
Laura: Well, and I think, too… I originally had this slotted for Odds & Ends for the chapter, but I think it’s relevant to the conversation we’re having right now. There is a point in the chapter – Eric, you called out – where Harry is like, “Hey, you said at the end of last term you were going to tell me everything,” and Dumbledore says, “And so I did. I told you everything I know.” So I think we need to add to the Dumbledore Lie Count.
[Dumbledore Lie Count sound effect plays]
Laura: Dumbledore is clearly trying to set this up to kind of Socratic Method Harry, as we were talking about. He’s trying to teach him, he’s trying to allow Harry to make his own connections, and I wonder if that’s because… or if that’s part of Dumbledore setting Harry up to be ready for this, because we do see in “The Prince’s Tale,” in the next book, Dumbledore talking about Harry being ready at the opportune moment, and perhaps part of the way that he’s teaching Harry is allowing Harry to make some of these discoveries on his own. We definitely see in Bob Ogden’s memory, after they come out of it, Harry starts picking up on things like, “Wait, Marvolo. I know that name.” And so Dumbledore is like, “Ah, yes, very clever. You remember what that is, huh?” And so that’s also a great connection back to Chamber of Secrets. But getting back to the memory, Dumbledore is taking Harry on a journey into Bob Ogden’s memory, and just as a recap here, Ogden was the Head of the Department of Magical Law Enforcement, and according to Dumbledore, had died some time ago. But Dumbledore said, “not before I tracked him down and persuaded him to confide his recollections of this memory,” so that some-time-ago timeframe, based on Ogden’s death, means Dumbledore could have obtained this information years ago.
Eric: Yep.
Laura: Not just in the last year, like we’ve seen him doing with some of his other Horcrux discovery.
Micah: Yeah, he’s been tracking Voldemort for some time. It’s clear that he’s been trying to gain as much information as he possibly can on him, and this could be prior to even thinking that Horcruxes were a possibility.
Andrew: And speaking of the Dumbledore Lie Count, this revelation flies in the face of Dumbledore’s claim that he had previously told Harry everything he knows. If that were true, then he would have shared a lot more of this information earlier on, because he’s been tracking Voldemort for a while. He’s been researching this for a while.
Eric: Yeah, there’s tons of stuff that Dumbledore… Dumbledore is full of fun facts that are relevant to Harry that will never quite get conveyed to Harry, and there’s a little bit of fun we can have in trying to enumerate them or figure out what they all are. But really, I think there is a helpful spirit in Dumbledore here; he does want to convey this… this is the way in which Dumbledore feels comfortable telling Harry that he has to be the one to die, or figure out how to destroy a bunch of Horcruxes that are left. Because ultimately, we know that that’s something that Dumbledore feared revealing to Harry; that’s why he waited until last year to even mention the prophecy. So I think that we’re getting probably the best version of Dumbledore that Dumbledore is capable of providing right now.
Micah: I’m wondering, though, for us as readers… and I’m just thinking about this now because Laura, you mentioned how Bob Ogden was not just a member; he was the Head of the Department of Magical Law Enforcement. You’re sending out a pretty big gun here to deal with Morfin Gaunt. Did any of us pick that up? You’re not just sending an Auror or somebody further down the totem pole; we saw earlier in this book the Head of the Department of Magical Law Enforcement, Amelia Bones, murdered.
Andrew: Yes. So this registered with me today, too, reading it for today’s episode. I do think that says something, that they’re sending the Head of the Magical Law Enforcement. I think they anticipated some problems. I think they anticipated that this wasn’t going to go easy for them.
Laura: I see in the Discord, NoMajNoProblem is calling out that Morfin had priors.
[Eric and Micah laugh]
Laura: And that’s kind of what I was thinking, too, is they’ve had problems with Morfin and the Gaunt family before, and I think that’s why they’re sending the big guns in. I also think we have to think about the timeline here, and this would have been in, what, the 1920s? Well before Grindelwald, well before any of the major modern wizarding conflicts that we know of. So I would just tend to think that approaches to security and what it means to send department heads out would just be different, kind of thinking about how much the world has changed for all of us since 9/11, for example. I think we can all think of ways that life was very, very different before that happened, so it kind of makes sense to me, when you put it that way.
Andrew: I see Marvolo’s treatment of law enforcement similar to how in the Muggle world, people are kind of isolated from the rest of society, and they don’t like listening to city folk. They run by their own rules. They don’t maybe even follow the news. They don’t associate with other people; they don’t interact with other people.
Eric: They don’t recognize other authority.
Andrew: Exactly, other than their own personal authority. So when somebody from the city comes in and tries to tell them they have to go to court for something, they freak the hell out! They don’t want to be told what to do. They’re cut off from the rest of society in their mind.
Laura: Yeah, well, and we definitely see that in the way that Morfin greets Ogden when he arrives, because Morfin… well, first of all, there’s a dead snake nailed to the door of the Gaunt house, which is quite an omen.
Eric: RIP.
Laura: But then Morfin appears, and he starts yelling at Ogden in Parseltongue. And at first Harry is kind of confused, because he’s like, “I don’t know why you’re so confused about what this guy’s saying to you; it’s pretty clear to me.” But then it turns out that Morfin is just hissing at him, literally, “You’re not welcome here. Get out.”
Eric: Still, if a guy is hissing at me, I’m probably going to back up a little bit, even if I can’t make it out.
Laura: For real.
Micah: You’ve been on the New York City subways too, Eric?
[Andrew and Laura laugh]
Eric: Probably like, 17 times at this point.
Laura: I was going to say, I think if a rando brandishing a bloody knife and a dead snake is hissing at me, I’ve received the message.
Eric: That said, I think that it’s a perfectly good point that Morfin is not… we see later he can speak English, and that’s a question: Can he actually speak it? He can, but by choosing not to, he’s also not respecting Ogden. He’s not communicating with Ogden in a way that his words are going to be received or understood, so even his warning, even his “You’re not welcome here,” is not actually meant to convey the sense of danger; it’s just meant to scare Ogden.
Laura and Micah: Yeah.
Micah: And it’s a strong connection to Chamber of Secrets, and Harry’s learning that he can speak Parseltongue, so this is another little nugget that’s come up that ties us back to Book 2.
Laura: Definitely. And I think it’s also a good time to do a little name origin about the Gaunt family. We were speaking previously about how they are clearly very isolated from broader society, and we see it brought up both in the descriptions provided of these characters, as well as something Dumbledore says later in the chapter, that the Gaunt family kind of kept it in the family, if you will. The gene pool is a little shallow, right, Micah?
Micah: It is, but I think you see that a lot throughout history with what you would call pure-blood families, because you can only marry within your own family, in some cases, if you want to keep the bloodlines pure. But we’ll talk a little bit about that. As far as the name origin goes for Gaunt…
[Name origin sound effect plays]
Micah: … when you’re referring to a person, it is somebody who appears as lean and haggard, especially because of suffering, hunger, or age. And I think that’s definitely applicable here to both Marvolo and Morfin in terms of how they come across. I think Merope is more a product of the treatment that she’s receiving from her father and her brother, but also applicable to her appearance when we first meet her as well.
Andrew: Definitely, and I think the last name Gaunt also is symbolic of how, again, separated they are from the rest of society. To outsiders, as we see in this chapter, they are other. They are less than. They’re kind of stuck with them on the edge of town.
Micah: Yeah. And then Merope, the star, is often called the Lost Pleiad, because she was, at first, not seen by astronomers or charted like her sisters were. One myth says that she hid her face in shame because she had an affair with a mortal man.
Laura: Oooh, that’s a great connection.
Andrew: Wow.
Micah: There’s a lot of mythological ties with Merope, but this one seems to be the most applicable, and give us the best through-line, given her relationship with Tom Riddle, Sr.
Eric: While we’re on the subject, something that I never knew before… Stephen Fry, whose audiobooks I’m listening to this go round for the first time, pronounces it “Mare-oh-pay.”
Andrew and Laura: Hmm.
Eric: When I first read this book, I was like, “Oh, Merope.” [pronounces it “Mer-ope”] And then I realized how stupid that sounds; I’m like, “No, it’s Merope.” [pronounces it “Mer-oh-pee”] And now I’m kind of on a Merope [pronounces it “Mare-oh-pay”] kick. So I just want to bring that up as an alternative. I’m not sure.
Micah: [laughs] Well, you do you.
Laura: Listen, I think as Americans, we learned a lot of lessons about name pronunciations from Harry Potter. I will flat-out admit as a child, when I read the first three books, I thought Seamus was pronounced “Seem-us.”
Andrew: Same.
Laura: And that’s how I said it in my mind for three years, until I was reading it out loud one day and my dad was like, “No.”
[Eric and Laura laugh]
Andrew: And “Hermy-own.” We all did the “Hermy-own” thing too.
Laura: Oh, yeah. “Hermy-one.”
Eric: All this to say, as long as our listeners at home know of whom we are speaking, then there’s nothing wrong with it. No shame in “Seem-us.”
Micah: No, I remember from studying mythology in college, the way that it was always pronounced was “Mer-oh-pee,” but that could just be a preference of the professor. It could be totally wrong. [laughs] I don’t know.
Eric: Yeah, I don’t think it’s wrong, but just an alternative.
Laura: Something I think is really interesting about Morfin and Merope is when you read their depictions and the way they behave, they come across as almost childlike. Morfin is playing some version of an abusive game with snakes that he’s capturing, and he’s literally sitting by the fireplace humming this pretty violent nursery rhyme that he’s apparently come up with. And Merope is… I mean, she’s really… it seems like she’s just trying to hide and fly under the radar. But in the chapter, Morfin is described as a man, and later on in the chapter, Dumbledore refers to Merope escaping the prison she’d called home for the first 18 years of her life once her father and brother were arrested, so these two are adults.
Andrew: Yeah, you get the impression that they’ve just suffered from a lot of stunted development. And Dumbledore is taking Harry into this memory to show the Voldemort origin story, and you can see why Tom Riddle, Jr./Voldemort had stunted development as well. He was born out of a false romance and has bad family origins, bad family bloodline. Underdeveloped.
Eric: It’s definitely a sympathetic look at Tom Riddle from the start. This might be my favorite memory; it’s harrowing to read through, but it’s such an interesting insight into somewhere that we otherwise would never look. And Marvolo’s pride for where he comes from, despite, as Dumbledore tells Harry, the family fortune that would have come with all this prestige is long squandered even before Marvolo was born. It shows how sad it was and tragic that… how are these people existing? And with no formal education. We’re shown the kind of home life that Merope has, and it’s terrifyingly tragic.
Micah: And Laura, to your earlier point about them keeping it in the family, Dumbledore mentions the Gaunts were “a very ancient wizarding family noted for a vein of instability and violence that flourished through the generations due to their habit of marrying their own cousins.” So there’s a very backwoods feeling here, and not just from them, but from the house when we first get the description. And we’re really following Bob Ogden as he’s navigating the pathway to get to the Gaunt house, and he doesn’t even realize – or at least Harry doesn’t realize, initially – that they’ve finally stumbled upon this cottage. And I think just more broadly, the descriptions that we’re getting… even when Morfin jumps out of the tree, right? Eric, I know you have something here as well, but it’s just almost like you’ve been removed from day-to-day society.
Eric: Yeah, something else I wanted to point out is that there is actually a physical trait that is assigned – and has been, since Book 2 – to Salazar Slytherin. I just had to find this moment in Chamber of Secrets. But when Harry first enters the Chamber of Secrets – this is page 307 – “Harry had to crane his neck to look up into the giant face above: It was ancient and monkeyish, with a long, thin beard that fell almost to the bottom of the wizard’s sweeping stone robes.” This phrase, “monkeyish,” this term, is actually echoed in his great-great-great descendant, Morfin, who is also given some simian, monkeyish, apelike characteristics. It’s a very interesting… I don’t know. What would you say it’s describing? More stature? Or prominent features in the face?
Laura: Yeah, no, it’s interesting. I feel like… doesn’t Marvolo get a similar description specifically around the way he outstretches his arms at one point?
Eric: Yeah, long arms.
Laura: So it definitely seems like there’s some kind of familial trait here, which makes me wonder was Slytherin himself inbred? I mean, it would make sense if he also valued…
Eric: Was so pure-blood crazy.
Laura: Yeah, it would make sense that that family line has always been inbred.
Eric: That’s an interesting thought. Here’s page 202: “This man was shorter than the first, and oddly proportioned; his shoulders were very broad and his arms overlong, which, with his bright brown eyes, short scrubby hair, and wrinkled face, gave him the look of a powerful, aged monkey.” Very interesting stuff, but what I love about that is it goes straight back to the source, right? Here is Marvolo bragging about being a descendant of Salazar Slytherin, and if you were to actually look at a statue of Salazar Slytherin, you’re like, “Ah, yeah, I can see it.”
Micah: For sure. And what I don’t think most people picked up on was that Southern Hagrid is actually on the back porch.
[Andrew and Laura laugh]
Eric: Oh! Of this shack?
Andrew: “Yeah, get off their lawn!”
Eric: Maybe he’s the reason that it’s half caved in. He sat on the roof by accident or something.
Laura: Well, we’re going to take one more quick break to go check our ancestry, to find out who our famous ancestors are and if there are any fun statues of them out there, but we’ll be right back after that.
[Ad break]
Laura: Okay, so we’re back, and we are at the point in this memory where Bob Ogden is now beyond just confronting Morfin, who is still wanting to brandish his knife at him; he’s letting Marvolo, his father, know that Morfin is being charged with not only performing magic in front of a Muggle, but performing it on a Muggle. And it’s really interesting in this whole exchange to see how Marvolo is really quick to defend his son for his criminal activity, but he’s so ready to throw Merope under the bus for the slightest mistake.
Eric: Ugh.
Laura: She drops a pan, and he loses his mind. Meanwhile, his son, as was called out in the Discord, literally has priors, and he’s just like, “Whatever.”
Andrew: “That’s my boy.”
Laura: “It was a Muggle. Who cares what happened?” Right? But it’s like, “Don’t drop the pans, Merope.”
Eric: His son can do no wrong; his daughter can do no right.
Laura: Yep, 100%. So we learn that Morfin had attacked a Muggle the prior day, leaving him covered with hives, and it’s confirmed that the Muggle that he attacked was Tom Riddle, Sr., who was riding by.
Eric: Who fortunately has forgotten about the whole thing.
Laura: Yes, riding by with his fiancée. And the reason that Morfin attacks him in the first place is because he’s caught on to the fact that his sister Merope is kind of sweet on this Muggle man. So Morfin not only attacks Tom Riddle, Sr., but he chooses this opportunity to throw his sister under the bus and say, “Yeah, I did it because she has a crush on that nasty Muggle.” But it feels like he’s also doing it in this moment to elicit a response from his father, because of course Marvolo is going to be embarrassed that it’s being revealed in front of this stranger that his daughter has feelings for a Muggle.
Andrew: Yeah. Tensions are already high, and he’s bringing this up when Marvolo is already in a vulnerable position. So what do you make of that? That he wants to get his sister into more trouble?
Laura: Yeah. I mean, I think it’s deflection, right?
Eric: Yeah, I do think… there is a point where Marvolo tells Morfin to be quiet, to basically stop confessing. There’s some ounce of intelligence and awareness in Marvolo that is lost on Morfin. And in that moment, I think Morfin is bored. I think that he wants to get a rise, to deflect, and put attention on his sister again, which works only too well. It’s just a really shitty thing to do because she is… poor Merope is still just constantly being abused there.
Micah: Right. And Marvolo, much like another wizarding family we know, thinks that last name and legacy trump criminal activity, and that only works in so much – to your point, Eric – if Morfin keeps his mouth shut, if he doesn’t keep basically bragging about what he’s done. And we see Marvolo really double, triple down on the fact that they’re the last living descendants of Salazar Slytherin, and the hope is that is going to somehow absolve his son from this crime that he has committed.
Laura: Right. And I mean, it’s kind of pathetic, very sad, actually, because as Ogden is like, “Okay, I don’t really care about your pure-blood status,” Marvolo is just like, “Look at this jewelry that came from my ancestor, Salazar Slytherin. We’re way too important for these Ministry summons, okay?”
[Andrew and Eric laugh]
Eric: “Look at this stuff. Isn’t it neat?”
[Andrew and Laura laugh]
Laura: Exactly, and it’s like, these are probably the most valuable things that they own.
Eric: Yeah. I mean, one of them is a Deathly Hallow, for crying out loud.
Laura: Right.
Eric: Probably doesn’t know that.
Laura: No.
Micah: Doubt he does. So one of the other things with Marvolo that is very clear in this chapter is that he is physically abusive of Merope, so much so that it suppresses her magical abilities. And this comes up when Dumbledore is talking about how she was able to brew a love potion that could then keep Tom Riddle, Sr. under her control. So clearly, because of the way she’s being treated, her magical ability has been suppressed, and we’re all too familiar with that from another sibling of another character that we know very well.
Eric: It’s interesting because one of the things that I loved about the Fantastic Beasts film series… you guys remember that? Existed for a couple years?
Andrew: Yes, good times.
Laura and Micah: Yeah.
Micah: Heard of it.
Laura: I remember something about that.
Eric: This idea of an Obscurus, or an Obscurial, as the person who has an Obscurus. And it’s when your magic is suppressed, it turns inward and eventually explodes out of you, the way we see it happening with Credence. Let’s just say that only Movie 1 exists. But yeah, so I was thinking with Merope here, what we know about her, she very easily could have been on the path to developing something like an Obscurus.
Andrew: If she wasn’t already, right? We don’t know for sure that she wasn’t, because you can go in and out of it, transform if you want. It’s Morfin time, as has been brought up in the chat.
[Everyone laughs]
Andrew: Yeah, but I think it’s a good connection, because both of these girls have faced great tragedies that weren’t their fault. In Merope’s case, just her family members.
Eric: And Ariana, for being… we know what happened with her. She also was traumatized and had to be kept…
Andrew: Right, yeah.
Laura: I mean, I would venture to say that probably what saves Merope from that fate is her father and brother being carted off to Azkaban.
Andrew: Ooh, yeah.
Laura: Right? And so then she’s able to escape, as Dumbledore said. She’s able to escape that life, and it’s not… the circumstances are not great, but she does the only thing she can think of to do. Because again, we know neither of the Gaunt children received formal educations. It also made me want to ask the question about descendants of Salazar Slytherin. Do we think that the descendants of Slytherin chose not to send their children to Hogwarts once he left school?
Eric: Oh, oh, that’s interesting.
Andrew: I bet so.
Laura: And that’s a multi-generational form of protest. They’re like, “We’re going to be ignorant.” [laughs]
Eric: So none of them ever… yeah, wow. That makes it more dangerous.
Andrew: “If he’s not there, the school’s not worth our time.”
Eric: Wow.
Micah: I can see that. So I did want to briefly mention Tom Riddle, Sr. and Cecilia…
Eric: [singing “Cecilia” by Simon & Garfunkel] “Cecilia…”
Micah: … because I think they are very much the Muggle world equivalents of the Malfoys and other pure-blood families that we encounter in this series, because it is very interesting that both Tom Riddle, Sr. and Marvolo Gaunt are looking down on each other.
Eric: Oh, yeah, yeah. And Cecilia has this line where it’s like, “Couldn’t your father clear that out? That hovel over there?” And he’s like, “Well, actually, it’s not our property, believe that or not.”
Micah: So I know Marvolo is an ass, but I want to make sure we give Tom Riddle, Sr. his due here as well, [laughs] because he’s not a nice guy.
Laura: No, he’s not.
Micah: From what we see.
Eric: Well, I still feel bad for him.
Laura: No, he’s not, but he also is a victim of what is going to happen to him without his consent. And we do learn a little more about that later, where Dumbledore does his guesswork, as he calls it earlier on in the chapter, to kind of piece together what happens. But it’s very clear that after Morfin and Marvolo go to Azkaban, that’s when Merope seizes the chance to bewitch, if you will, Tom Riddle, Sr. and preggo and get out, and we’re later going to learn about what happens to her after that. But bringing it back to Ogden’s memory, being the subject of what Harry and Dumbledore are looking at tonight, Ogden ultimately flees after trying to save Merope from her father’s physical abuse. When he does that, Morfin tries to attack him, and so he just gives up and takes off. We find out later that he actually came back with reinforcements; that’s one of the other details that Dumbledore fills in the blanks on when he and Harry get back to the office. But Harry, who’s being very observant here… which I’m really proud of, because there are a lot of times where Harry is not observant at all…
[Eric laughs]
Laura: … and he misses stuff that is so infuriating. He actually notices the ring that Dumbledore was wearing the night that they went to get Slughorn. He notices that the stone that has the Peverell coat of arms on it is cracked.
Andrew: Yeah, good catch. And I think this is one reason, as I think we may have said earlier, that Dumbledore is taking Harry into these memories, why he is sharing these wild guesses with him and taking big swings. He wants Harry to start thinking critically about Tom Riddle, Jr.’s and Voldemort’s life, so he can figure out the pieces and ultimately defeat Voldemort come next year. So it makes a lot of sense why, we were asking earlier, should Harry trust Dumbledore? I was asking earlier, should Harry trust Dumbledore when Dumbledore is like, “Yeah, these are big guesses,” but this is all to get him thinking differently and critically, and we see it working. Dumbledore must have had a gleam of triumph in his eye, seeing Harry think critically about all this.
Laura: Gleam of triumph, but also being like, “You’re still going to have to figure some of this out, my man. Have fun.”
Andrew: Yeah, the clock’s a-ticking.
Eric: “Gee, I hope your classmate summons Horcrux books for my study after I die at the end of this year. Hope she thinks to do that, because otherwise there’s no plot next year.”
Andrew: [laughs] “So yes, please do share this information with Ron and Hermione. I totally trust them, and that’s why you can share this info.”
[Everyone laughs]
Micah: Well, I feel like he knows he’s going to share it, probably regardless of what Dumbledore tells him to.
[Andrew laughs]
Laura: Right.
Eric: But he’s like, “Please tell them not to tell anybody.”
Andrew: Yes. Well, it’s an important thing to add.
Eric: Like, “Yes, Harry, it’s okay. You can. But can you tell Hermione not to tell her,” what, one other…? Does she have any other friends besides Ron and Harry?
[Andrew and Eric laugh]
Laura: Yeah, I feel like the one I’d worry about is Ron, honestly. And I love Ron, but Ron sometimes runs off at the mouth.
Odds & Ends
Laura: Any other odds and ends we want to touch on before we get to MVP?
Andrew: I just wanted to make clear here at the end what were the big reasons why Dumbledore showed Harry this memory, this specific memory? We’re introduced to Horcruxes…
Micah: I’m so glad you asked, Andrew.
Andrew: Yeah, yeah. What do you think, Micah? Why? [imitating Dumbledore] “Why did I do it? Tell me.”
Micah: [laughs] It’s all about the Horcruxes, baby.
Andrew: Oh, yeah, baby.
Micah: That’s what it comes down to; it was to reveal the ring and the locket. And then in just a few chapters from now, we get the Mrs. Cole memory, where Dumbledore proceeds to get her drunk to get the information out of her, but that’s really to reveal the cave location to us and the importance of where Voldemort may have hidden one of his Horcruxes. And then a little bit later on in Half-Blood Prince, we get the cup memory with Hepzibah Smith in Chapter 20. So the memories are really… yes, they are to give us backstory on Voldemort, but it’s really to allow, I think, both Dumbledore and Harry to start to figure out what items Voldemort used for his Horcruxes.
Andrew: Yeah, and even though Harry is a kid, I think probably Dumbledore finds it very helpful to bounce ideas off of somebody. So there’s that stuff; great points, Micah. It’s all about the Horcruxes, hashtag. But also, like I said earlier, just establishing Tom Riddle, Jr.’s origins. He was born out of a love potion, his parents never loved each other truly, and his birth came under false pretenses, and his mom’s side of the family were Muggle-hating impoverished loners who no one liked. It just all builds a case for why Voldemort became the person that he did, and why he couldn’t foresee love being a powerful weapon.
Laura: Yeah, and it is so fascinating to see his family of origin, even though he doesn’t grow up with them, because he places so much emphasis on being a descendant, a direct descendant, of Salazar Slytherin…
Eric: Oh, yeah.
Laura: … and it’s like, “Honestly, man, if you had to pick which environment you would have been better growing up in, your mother’s family or your father’s family…” I’m not saying Tom Riddle, Sr. was any great shakes, but he would have had a better upbringing with his Muggle father than what ended up happening as a result of his pure-blood mother and her actions.
Eric: Yeah, you’d have to go back several generations or more to find a descendant of Salazar Slytherin that was anything to be proud of, I think.
Laura: Well, we’re going to ask a related question in our Lynx Line coming up.
Superlative of the Week
Laura: But before we get to that, it is time for MVP of the Week, and this week, we’re going to be giving Bob Ogden his flowers. I think he had some great moments in this chapter, so I wanted to ask y’all, what are the best Bob moments in the “House of Gaunt” chapter?
Eric: The bits of Bob.
[MVP of the Week music plays]
Andrew: So when Gaunt says, “Can’t just walk in here and not expect my son to defend himself,” Ogden says, “Defend himself against what, man?” And the reason I’m calling that out is it sounds so American. “Hey, man.”
[Eric and Laura laugh]
Andrew: “Defend himself against what, man?” That’s my best Jamie doing an American impression.
Laura: Yeah. [laughs]
Micah: Eh, I can see a little bit of the British element to that, no?
Andrew: I guess. If you said “mate,” it would make more sense.
Eric: “Defend against what, man?”
Andrew: Oh, all right. Well, I still loved how blunt it was.
Eric: Yeah, yeah. I’m going to give flowers to Bob for just escaping the shack. Marvolo might have made fun of some fancy shoes if he were wearing them, but they helped him escape with his life, so good for Bob.
Micah: I really liked… it was during the conversation where Marvolo was trying to absolve his son of what he had done to Tom Riddle, Sr., and Bob says, “It’s a matter of law, sir, not opinion.”
[Andrew laughs]
Laura: And on a related note, when Marvolo pivots to trying to establish his superiority based on bloodline and his suspicion that Ogden’s family must be a bunch of dirty Muggles, Ogden says, “I am afraid that neither your ancestors nor mine have anything to do with the matter in hand.”
Andrew: Love it. There you go, Bob. There’s some love for you this holiday season. RIP.
Eric: Aww.
Laura: He deserves it.
Lynx Line
Laura: And now we’re going to get into this week’s Lynx Line. Slug Club level patrons over at Patreon.com/MuggleCast have answered this week’s question, which was: What do you think Salazar Slytherin would have thought about the Gaunts as his direct descendants?
Andrew: Oooh. Justin, who’s listening live tonight, said,
“He would have just killed them. It’s undeniable that he was interested in his legacy. He left behind a Mudblood murder trap. I think we need to reevaluate Slytherin apologists in this new age of shameless grifting and racism.”
[Laura laughs]
Andrew: Oh. All right.
Eric: Michael says, “He would view their living conditions as a lack of ambition.” I agree with that.
Andrew: That’s not very Slytherin-like.
Micah: Zachary says,
“I think he’d be overwhelmingly disgusted. Marvolo and his ilk are pretty much the Uncle Ricos of his name -“ nice Napoleon Dynamite reference “- boasting of their lineage but having nothing to show but words and a locket. I think if he could’ve chosen a modern family, it would be the Malfoys. They not only have wealth, but influence over the Ministry.”
Laura: Yep. Matthew says,
“I think if he saw them, he would be forced to accept the frailty of his bigoted worldview. His heart would turn, and he’d realize that Muggle-borns and pure-blood should all live together in harmony. Because that’s what people do when they see evidence that contradicts their worldviews, right?”
Andrew: Susan said,
“I think he would be super disappointed in the living conditions of his descendants, and while he might not like Voldy’s parentage, he might be pleased with his plans for the wizarding world.”
Eric: Kayla says,
“I think he would be amused by them. I think he would feel kind of respected but also kind of embarrassed. I think it would be one of those moments where you feel half good and half bad about the situation.”
Micah: And finally, Rachel says,
“I think he’d be happy to see his descendants have maintained their pure-blood status but dismayed by their living conditions. I’m not sure what he’d make of Tom Riddle, Jr., a half-blood, but also a very powerful wizard who deeply believes in what Salazar stood for.”
Eric: I do think Salazar would be super proud of how Voldemort wielded the Basilisk and attacked a bunch of students in year two. I think he’d be very proud of that.
Andrew: Thanks, everyone, who contributed to our Lynx Line today, and there are more responses over on the post if patrons want to go and check those out. If you have any feedback about today’s episode, you can contact us by emailing or sending a voice memo that you record on your phone to MuggleCast@gmail.com. You can also reach out via the Spotify comments, the YouTube comments, social media, whatever is convenient for you. And speaking of feedback, our final episode of the year is next week, and we will close out 2025 with a special Muggle Mail episode, so look forward to that. [imitating Dumbledore] “Another year, gone.”
Eric: I also want to shout out real quick, Camille, who’s listening live, actually has a tarot podcast that she mentioned. So earlier, we were talking about Trelawney’s predictions. The podcast is called “Every Day Tarot,” and evidently she did a whole series of Divination in the Harry Potter books and how Trelawney is right a lot of the time, but doubts herself. So check out “Every Day Tarot” if you haven’t gotten enough tarot discussion.
Laura: Cool.
Andrew: You can visit MuggleCast.com for links to our social media, our Patreon, our transcripts, our favorite episodes, and lots more. And if you’re looking for more podcasting from the four of us, you can listen to our other podcasts, Millennial and What the Hype?!, for more pop culture and real world talk.
Quizzitch
Andrew: And now it’s time for Quizzitch.
[Quizzitch music plays]
Eric: This week’s question: In William Shakespeare’s famous love story Romeo and Juliet, Juliet drinks a potion to fake her death, putting her to sleep for over a day. Where is she when she drinks it? The correct answer was her bed chamber. It’s a sad, sad moment. 58% of people with the correct answer said they didn’t look it up; good on you for remembering your middle to high school assignment. Congratulations, everybody. And the correct answers were submitted by PANTS!; A Healthy Breeze; Cheese Shark; Faking Your Own Death Is Peak Dumbledore, Actually; Gwen Weasley; It’s Juliet, not Yuliet; It’s Row-MAY-oh, Not Row-mee-Oh; Mercutio and Romeo should have got together; Mercutio sounds like a Harry Potter spell; QuidWitch; TeacherOfMuggles; and That Bookish Hufflepuff. Fun names as usual. Here is next week’s Quizzitch question: In this chapter, we first see Salazar Slytherin’s locket around the neck of Merope Gaunt [pronounces it “Mer-oh-pee”], or Merope. [pronounces it “Mare-oh-pay”] Which British queen popularized lockets during her reign, often wearing lockets to commemorate her friends and loved ones? Submit your answer to us on the MuggleCast website using the Quizzitch form located at MuggleCast.com/Quizzitch. If you’re already on our website doing some stuff, click on “Quizzitch” from the main nav.
Andrew: Thanks, everybody, for listening. We’ll see you next week for our final episode of the year. I’m Andrew.
Eric: I’m Eric.
Micah: I’m Micah.
Laura: And I’m Laura.
Andrew: We’ve got to go; it’s Morfin time. Bye, everyone!
Laura: [laughs] Bye.