Transcript #193

MuggleCast 193 Transcript

Show Intro

[Intro music begins]

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[“Hedwig’s Theme” plays]

Jim Dale: [as Professor McGonagall] This is Professor McGonagall welcoming you all to MuggleCast hoping you enjoy – Dobby! Dobby, come here! Here! Dobby! [as Dobby] Yes, I’d just like to say how very pleased I am to introduce MuggleCast to all of you! Thank you! Thank you!

[Show music begins]

Micah: Because Stuart Craig is a man’s man, this is MuggleCast Episode 193 for March the 4th, 2010.

[Show music continues]

Andrew: Welcome to MuggleCast Episode 193! Here today with Ben, Jaime, Eric, and Micah. Hey boys!

Ben: Hey, Andrew.

Jamie: Hey.

Micah: Hey.

Andrew: I feel like the fans – you know our audience is primarily girls – they really – I hope they enjoy these all-boy programs. You know what I’m saying?

Eric: Yeah.

Micah: Well, we lost Laura to Costa Rica so there’s not much we can do about that.

Andrew: Yeah, unfortunately.

Eric: [laughs] Costa Rica stole her away.

Andrew: We have a big show today. Last week – or last episode there was no news. Now there’s a ton of news and a big Chapter-by-Chapter. Big show! Big show all around! I’m Andrew Sims.

Ben: I’m Ben Schoen.

Eric: I’m Eric Scull.

Jamie: I’m Jamie Lawrence.

Micah: And I’m Micah Tannenbaum.

[Show music continues]

Andrew: Go ahead Micah. Lay the news on us. Lots of news going on.

Ben: Lay it on me Micah.

News: Deathly Hallows Interviews

Micah: All right, let’s start with some Deathly Hallows interviews. A lot of these have been going on, most of them not really related to Movie 7. The interviews weren’t done specifically for Movie 7, but a lot of actors and actresses are out there promoting new things that they’re doing and of course Harry Potter questions come up. I guess we’ll start with Stuart Craig. He was discussing his career in The Telegraph a couple weeks ago and of course they got on to he topic of the seventh film, and one of the interesting things that he said was that Snape dies an extremely good death and he was quite upset about it.

Ben: A good death?

Micah: He said he was in tears. Can you believe that?

Andrew: I don’t know. I mean Stuart Craig, he’s such a man’s man.

[Everyone laughs]

Andrew: To hear that he’s crying over checking out this scene in the film, but that’s great. That’s great to hear. He said that’s the only time he’s cried I think.

Ben: Does everybody know who Stuart Craig is?

Andrew: He is the production designer. He designs all the amazing Harry Potter sets.

Eric: And he was just on set when they did that and that’s without editing, without hard cutting, without music.

Andrew: Right.

Eric: That’s how good – we’re meant to believe that Alan Rickman’s acting was really good.

Andrew: I believe Stuart Craig. He’s not one to overhype anything.

Eric: Yeah, yeah.

Andrew: He puts himself down a lot.

Eric: He doesn’t put out all these stories where he’s crying over stuff.

Andrew: [laughs] Right.

Eric: He’s pretty solid. Tried and tested.

Andrew: Unlike everyone else. “Best movie yet! Best movie yet!”

Jamie: Yeah, but, they’re bigging it up, aren’t they? Everyone’s saying how the ending’s going to be colossal, it’s going to be incredible – surely you would say that.

Andrew: Yes.

Jamie: You’re going to have to say that about Book 7, aren’t you? You’re going to say that the ending’s going to be the best thing you’ve ever seen in the world, ever.

Andrew: [laughs] That’s true. All right – what other Deathly Hallows news, Micah?

News: Dan Radcliffe Interview

Micah: Well, Dan Radcliffe has been doing some promotion for a charity that he is a big part of called The Trevor Project. And in an interview discussing it he also was asked questions about Deathly Hallows and he talked a little bit recently about the epilogue, the forest scene filming, and more…

Andrew: I have audio, I have audio.

Micah: …you have audio – oh, look at that.

Andrew: Would you like audio? Yes, here you go.

[Interview audio plays]

Interviewer: Epilogue? Have you done it yet – have you seen yourself old – have you seen any of the tests or anything?

Daniel Radcliffe: No, not yet. We’ve done a few tests and it does look really, really rather good. And hopefully – the one thing I’ll say – is that my daughter is hopefully going to be played by the daughter of Amanda Knight who is the head of the makeup department…

Interviewer: Wonderful.

Daniel Radcliffe: …and she was born a week before I got the part. And is now nine. And so it’s the kind of physical embodiment of how long we’ve been there. [laughs]

Interviewer: Wow. [laughs]

Daniel Radcliffe: And she’s got red hair like Ginny and blue eyes like me, so she’s perfect to play our daughter.

Interviewer: A fitting testament to the passage of time, right?

Daniel Radcliffe: Absolutely! I couldn’t have put it better myself.

[Interview audio ends]

Andrew: So that’s kind of cool – they’re making it sort of go full circle in a subtle little way.

Jamie: That is kind of cool, yeah.

Micah: A lot of people had a problem with the blue eyes comment.

Eric: [laughs] Yeah.

Andrew: Mmmm.

Eric: What color are Harry’s eyes?

Micah: Not blue.

Andrew: Green!

Ben: “Green as a fresh pickled toad, the one who conquered the Dark Lord”.

Eric: I was like, “Wow, that’s pretty cool”…

Jamie: Green as a pack of pickles. Bet you haven’t heard that for awhile.

[Everyone laughs]

Eric: Jamie, your mission is complete.

Ben: So what is The Trevor Project? It’s for…

Andrew: The Trevor Project, it’s this – it’s basically this hotline that people who are maybe in the closet or unsure of their sexuality, they can call and ask for – get some help, like counseling sort of, over the phone.

Jamie: Why is it called The Trevor Project?

Andrew: Yes.

Jamie: But why is is called that?

Andrew: I guess it’s named after someone.

Jamie: Trevor.

Ben: Probably Trevor?

[Everyone laughs]

Andrew: Someone named Trevor.

Ben: And didn’t Dan Radcliffe come out and say that he’s not gay?

Andrew: He’s not gay.

Ben: Ooh.

Andrew: Sorry Ben. Ooh!

[Everyone laughs]

Jamie: Good one.

Eric: I saw your disappointed news post Andrew.

Ben: I’m going to start a new segment called Dear Dan.

[Andrew and Micah laugh]

Andrew: Frankly, I thought it was kind of uncalled for. Why is MTV asking? I don’t know…

Ben: But everyone’s dying to know Andrew.

Andrew: But there’s not – nobody’s dying to know, there hasn’t been some wild speculation over Dan’s sexuality so…

Ben: Oh, but there has been. Let’s be honest.

Jamie: I thought there was a while ago. Yeah, I thought there was.

Andrew: I guess, I guess.

Eric: Actually guys I have an answer for you. It’s actually named the Trevor Project because it’s based on a short film named Trevor which was a dramedy about a gay 13 year old boy who tries to commit suicide. So it’s actually this little known short film named Trevor, so that’s how that happened.

Andrew: Oh, okay.

Micah: Yeah so he does talk about a lot more in those interviews. They’re – they’re broken up into about ten different little segments. He talks about filming the forest scene with Gary Oldman and David Thewlis. And also that he’s very sad that the end of Deathly Hallows filming is near and that about four or five months are left in shooting. So that takes us just about up to Summer time.

Andrew: And that’s interesting because, you know, they – they started in February 2009. They started filming in February 2009 and they thought it was going to take a year. They were going to wrap up in about March or April. Now it’s pushed back to July so I don’t know, is that a good sign that maybe they’re – they’re putting in some extra time into filming these scenes, because clearly things have been pushed back.

Eric: They’re working on the third part. They’re working on the third…

Andrew: [laughs] The third part.

Ben: Or – yeah [laughs]. Or maybe – or maybe they’re just poor estimators of time.

Jamie: Yeah.

Andrew: Maybe too. I guess it’s probably is hard to predict how long it’s going to take to shoot two films back to back.

Jamie: Yeah that is true. That…

Andrew: Plus they had to break for Half-Blood Prince so they’re probably going to have to break for the opening of the theme park.

News: Helena Bonham Carter Interview

Micah: Absolutely. So another person who has been making the rounds because of Alice in Wonderland is Helena Bonham Carter. And she revealed some interesting information, saying that she really doesn’t think that she’s going to be in the first part of Deathly Hallows. She says most of her scenes come in the second so that can give us a little bit of an idea of where these two films are going to be split.

Eric: So her – wait – Hermione doesn’t use the Polyjuice Potion to turn into Bellatrix until the – the Gringotts scene right? Like…

Micah: Correct.

Eric: Until they have to break into her Gringotts vault. Okay so…

Ben: Am I the only one who thinks Bellatrix is kind of hot?

Andrew: She is hot.

Ben: Like in a…

Micah: Naughty sort of way?

Andrew: Now do you think it’s…

Ben: Creepy goth sort of way?

Andrew: Did you think that when you read the book? Or just seeing Helena play her on screen?

Ben: Well, when I read the book, you know, I liked the power. You know, Bellatrix is very powerful.

Andrew: Yeah, yeah.

Jamie: Ben, Ben, are you attracted to strong women? Is that what you’re saying?

Ben: Yeah, that is what I’m saying.

Andrew: Bodybuilding women.

[Everyone laughs]

Ben: Women on steroids!

[Everyone laughs]

Andrew: What – what else did she say?

Micah: Well, she did talk a little bit about the scene that Eric mentioned – having to play the role of Hermione and that it was interesting to go back and be 17-years-old. She wishes that she could actually do that in real life.

Andrew: Mmhm. Well I thought one of the bigger quotes from her was when she said, “I do get a good death scene”. That should be awesome.

Ben: [as Mrs. Weasley] “Not my daughter, you bitch!”

[Andrew laughs]

Jamie: Yeah, that’ll be interesting.

Andrew: Yeah, it will be.

Eric: I was thinking about that the other day. Does he say that in the audiobook? Does either Jim Dale or Stephen Fry, do they…

Andrew: Well, they must.

Jamie: They must do, yeah.

Eric: They must, but has anyone actually heard them curse?

Andrew: No, we should get the clip. That’s probably a good clip.

Ben: Not my daughter, you bleep.

Eric: See what I’m saying? Okay.

Andrew: I don’t think they bleep it out.

Ben: I know.

[Everyone laughs]

Micah: But it’s not the first time that “bitch” was used in the series.

Andrew: Right.

Eric: No, I mean – but – and he does say it in Prisoner of Azkaban. Like, I’ve heard that. It’s obviously a different context, but when it’s screamed in capitals…

Jamie: Who says it in Prisoner of Azkaban?

Ben: Aunt Marge when she’s talking about…

Eric: She’s talking about dogs, breeding…

Ben: Yeah.

Jamie: Oh, yeah, but that’s in a different context.

Eric: Yeah, that’s what I said. I mean, it’s the same word.

Ben: But a bitch is a bitch.

[Andrew laughs]

Eric: So many people e-mail in and they’re like, “Oh, there’s a curse word in Prisoner of Azkaban and you guys missed it.”

Andrew: Whatever. It’s a finer point. We didn’t miss it, we did talk about it a couple of episodes ago. So, anyway, but, yeah, Helena did say that her last day of filming was filming this death scene, so I guess that’s a good way to go out.

Jamie: Can I just make a correction? It’s not Huh-lane-ah. It’s Helena.

Andrew: Helena. Sorry. Sorry.

Jamie: [laughs] Wow. You guys.

Eric: Helena has been ruling here, Jamie, because we haven’t had you, so I don’t even…

[Andrew laughs]

Eric: …know the difference any more. I’m just…

Jamie: You guys say some weird things. You really do.

Andrew: I think that may be the American English pronunciation gap, but sorry.

News: Jason Isaacs Interview

Micah: All right. And then final bit of interviews was with Jason Isaacs, who plays Lucius Malfoy. So he did a couple of interviews in promotion of his new film and he talked a lot about just leaving the Potter films as a whole, that he’s done filming and that he’s very upset that he has to part with his wig.

Andrew: Aw.

Eric: And the cane.

Micah: And the cane.

Andrew: They should let him keep that wig. They said they weren’t going to let him keep it. I mean, it’s just like give it to him. You know they have more than one.

Jamie: It’s probably quite expensive, though. I bet it’s real human hair.

Andrew: Yeah.

Jamie: Or some type of thing. Unicorn hair.

Andrew: [laughs] Unicorn hair. That would be pretty awesome. I’d wear that.

Micah: But one quote from him was, “there’s one long sequence where everyone left standing when the forces of good meet the forces of evil.” That is going to be a pretty cool scene.

Andrew: Yeah. That reminds me of that giant Order of the Phoenix poster that was on billboards where you saw the good people on the left and the bad people on the right. But you never actually saw a scene that look like that in the film, it was just a promotional poster. So hopefully…

Jamie: What was the slogan for that? I can’t remember.

Andrew: I can’t remember either.

Micah: It’s getting darker.

Eric: It’s Order of the Phoenix. “You will lose everything.”

Jamie: Right, that was a cool slogan. That was quite good.

News: Theme Park Updates

Micah: All right, moving onto some theme park news, little updates. We’ve gotten a lot of new pictures over the course of a few weeks, since we’ve done our last show and it looks like the theme park is more or less coming together.

Andrew: I would hope so.

Micah: Yeah, not a whole lot more that I have to say about it.

[Andrew laughs]

Micah: We got a look at some new store fronts and new arial shots. Check it out in our galleries.

Andrew: [laughs] Yeah, there’s nothing, I guess, new to report, though Orlando – or Universal Orlando met with the Central Florida Vacation Home Managers and they revealed a couple of interesting things. They said there is going to be a frog choir that will perform five times a day in the park.

Micah: What?

Ben: Wow.

Eric: That’s cute….

Jamie: A frog choir?

Ben: I’m going to go audition.

[Andrew laughs]

Andrew: All right…

Jamie: You aren’t a frog Ben.

News: Potter Video Games

Micah: And last show we talked about both videos games, EA as well as the Lego Harry Potter video game and it looks like Electronic Arts will be doing a Deathly Hallows video game.

Ben: Cha-ching!

Micah: Yeah, exactly. And it probably will be just Part I, as we spoke about on the last show, and this came up by a tweet by James Phelps where he said he was back at Leavesden for a bit of press regarding the new HP7 game. It looks really impressive from everything we’ve seen of it.

Micah: I can’t really get too high on that, though.

Andrew: Yeah. They said that about the other ones, too. [laughs] So, whatever! I’m sorry, I’m not losing interest or anything, it’s just that as we discussed before the video games are not good.

Micah: No, they’re not.

Jamie: Well, Order of the Phoenix was okay.

Ben: If they really wanted to promote this game, they should take a page out of this new Major League Baseball game that’s coming out…

Andrew: Mhm.

Ben: …the first person to throw – to pitch a perfect game wins a million dollars.

Andrew: Ooh!

Jamie: That’s incredible!

Ben: So what they should do is they should have the first person to beat the game or whatever…

Andrew: Yeah.

Ben: …should get some type of prize. That would really promote it. I should work for Electronic Arts.

Andrew: The first person to defeat Voldemort or something.

Ben: Yeah.

Andrew: That’d be cool.

Jamie: Yeah.

Andrew: [laughs] That’s a cool idea!

News: J.K. Rowling Updates Twitter – Sort of

Micah: Yep. And speaking of Twitter, J.K. Rowling updated her account to say:

“This is the real me. But you won’t be hearing from me often, I am afraid, as pen and paper is my priority at the moment.”

Jamie: Wow! Deja vu! Deja vu.

[Everybody laughs]

Eric: I just have to complain about this, okay. Here’s the woman who has written 1,084,000 words for the Harry Potter books – and this is why Jo is not a good fit for Twitter. She tweets and literally says the same things she’s already said on Twitter. She reuses – ten of these eighteen words are reused from her last tweet, saying that “pen and paper is her priority at the moment.”

Jamie: You’d think she’d have P.R. people doing it, though.

Andrew: Yeah. In her defense…

Ben: Jo, I’ll do your Tweeter – Twitter.

Micah: Whoa, careful there. Careful.

Jamie: Steady on, Ben.

Eric: Careful.

Ben: Sorry, Jo.

Andrew: In Jo’s defense, I think she may not know how Twitter works. I think she may think…

Ben: Oh! Are you calling Jo dumb?

[Everybody laughs]

Andrew: No!

Ben: Are you calling one of the most prolific writers that ever…

Andrew: Stop it!

Ben: …of all time dumb?

Andrew: I’ll tell you what happened. She or her assistant may have been looking at the @replies, the recent ones, and people may be asking, “Is this really you? Is this really you?” So she decided, oh, let me put out another update for people who may have not read my other tweets. I…

Ben: Other tweet. Singular.

Andrew: No.

[Everyone laughs]

Jamie: Yeah, other tweet.

Andrew: Her first three tweets. There are three tweets in a row when she first sent it out. It was this message, but in three tweets. So I think she just – I don’t know. It’s obviously a disappointment to most of her followers.

Eric: But she is writing.

Andrew: Yeah, that was the good news. We hear that she’s still working on something.

Ben: Now do you think…

Jamie: I wonder what it is.

Ben: When she announces something, do you think we’re going to find out about it via Twitter?

Andrew: I hope so.

Ben: Or do you think she’s going to, you know, release a press release through her agent or do you think…

Andrew: I bet we’ll hear…

Ben: Do you think she’s going to use technology in advance?

Andrew: I bet we’ll hear – she’ll be like, “Announcement coming soon about something” or something like that. Maybe she’ll tease us on Twitter and then let the official announcement come out via press release.

Micah: Well, the website is pretty much finished, right? I don’t think she’s really going to use that anymore.

Andrew: [laughs] She’s done with that. Yeah.

Jamie: Her website, you mean?

Andrew: Yeah, who cares?

Ben: When’s the last time she updated it?

Andrew: It’s been a while.

Eric: Well, birthdays keep popping up, right? I mean, you get that…

Micah: But that’s all automated.

Andrew: Yeah.

Ben: Yeah, Jo doesn’t go in and update.

Andrew: Yeah, rolls out of bed, “Oh, it’s Ron’s birthday!” Updates the calendar.

[Eric and Jamie laugh]

Andrew: But, yeah, it definitely would be nice to see J.K. Rowling put out some real tweets. And you know, I’ve got to be honest, she was at the Brit Awards a couple weeks ago. That’s an all-day thing. She could take ten seconds to send out a tweet or two.

Jamie: Yeah, why doesn’t she?

Andrew: I don’t know. Because she says pen and paper is her priority.

Eric: Pen and paper is her priority.

Ben: That’s B.S.

Andrew: I know!

Ben: Jo!

Andrew: On the other hand, maybe she wants to put a lot of thought into her tweets. [laughs] Not many people do that.

Ben: This is true.

Jamie: Maybe.

Ben: Most people are just posting emo crap on there.

Micah: I mean, if she really wanted to she could respond to, what, five tweets a week?

Andrew: Yeah, I can’t see her doing that though. She’s too…

Jamie: Aw, that would get so annoying though!

Ben: What if Jo starts being emo on Twitter?

[Andrew and Jamie laugh]

Jamie: I hate this book series! It screwed my life.

Ben: She’s like, “I just don’t want to do it anymore!”

[Andrew laughs]

Ben: “I’m done!”

Andrew: Can you imagine? Wow, that would be huge. All right, Micah, and the final…

Jamie: Yeah.

Andrew: …story of the day.

News: Rowling and Meyer at the Oscars

Micah: Along the same lines with J.K. Rowling and looking to appeal to a younger demographic, the Oscar producers asked both her and Stephenie Meyer to present together at this year’s ceremony. However, both were not available.

Jamie: Hey…

Ben: Now do you think this is because of a feud?

Jamie: …who’s Stephenie Meyer again?

Andrew: Stephenie Meyer is the author of Twilight.

Jamie: I know, I know. I’m being sarcastic.

[Ben laughs]

Andrew: Oh.

Ben: Now do you think this is…

Eric: It’s got to be a feud.

Ben: Do you think this is symbolic of a feud?

Andrew: No.

Ben: There must be…

Andrew: It’s not a feud.

Jamie: Of course there’s not a feud.

Ben: Yeah, coincidence? I think not, man.

Andrew: No, no, no.

Ben: One thing Jo taught us is that there’s no such thing as a coincidence.

Andrew: No, I’ll tell you what it is. It has nothing to do with Stephenie Meyer. J.K. Rowling is not going to fly to L.A. to present an award. That’s ridiculous. She doesn’t present…

Jamie: Why?

Andrew: …awards. Because she’s across the world!

Ben: She’s too high and mighty, pen and paper is her priority.

Jamie: Andrew, she can practically charter a plane to herself. I’m sure she isn’t going to worry about it. It’s not like she has to be at work the next day.

Andrew: I’m not saying she’s worrying about it financially, but we know that Jo doesn’t travel the globe to do P.R. stuff. She’s a very…

Jamie: Private?

Andrew: Yeah. She’s a very private person. So she’s not going to go on…

Jamie: Yeah, but…

Ben: No, this reeks of scandal, guys.

[Everyone laughs]

Ben: This is – I have a feeling. Mark my words, this is going to be the biggest thing since Tiger Woods cheating on his wife right here.

[Andrew laughs]

Jamie: Oh, whatever! Whatever, Ben.

Andrew: Tabloid article! That’d be a good April Fools prank.

Ben: This’ll be huge.

Andrew: We should write it.

Ben: Huge.

Muggle Mail: Death Omens

Andrew: Yeah. All right, let’s get to Muggle Mail now. Eric, could you read the first one?

Eric: Yup! First one is from Franki, age 15 from Adelaide. He says:

“I was thinking after your first…”


“…after your last Episode, 192, that maybe there was something more to all of the death omens than dramatic irony. Because Harry is seeing all of these death omens in ‘Prisoner of Azkaban,’ he begins to freak out, but I think that this fear is there to show how much Harry grows over the series. In ‘Prisoner of Azkaban,’ Harry is only 13, and is afraid of dying, but in ‘Deathly Hallows,’ he’s 17, and while he’s still a bit afraid of dying, he sees – he still faces death with putting up a fight. I think this shows again the journey that Harry makes from the start of the books to the end. Of course, the omens are also a pretty cool dramatic irony because in the end, Harry does die. Any thoughts?”

Micah: Well, Ben, does Harry really die? I know you’ve written a thing or two about this.

Ben: He should have died.

Micah: [laughs] He should have.

Ben: He doesn’t die. I mean, he die – he doesn’t die.

Andrew: He goes in limbo.

Ben: He’s in limbo.

Eric: But he does.

Andrew: Temporarily.

Eric: He dies enough to – the part of him that is Voldemort’s soul dies. So…

Andrew: Yes.

Eric: …Voldemort’s soul gets unstuck from Harry.

Ben: And that’s symbolic of overcoming death.

Eric: What Frankie’s saying here about Harry being vulnerable when he’s young, I think we touched on that in Chapter-by-Chapter last week.

Muggle Mail: Time Turner

Andrew: Jamie, could you read the next e-mail?

Jamie: Destiny, age 23, from Minnesota. She writes:

“Hi, everyone. I just got done listening to Episode 192, and wanted to correct something Andrew said. Referring to how Hermione got the Time Turner, he said that in the movie, Hermione told Harry Dumbledore gave her the Time Turner, but it was in fact Professor McGonagall, as in the book.”

Schoolboy, Andrew. Absolute schoolboy.

“Hermione tells Harry, ‘This is a Time Turner, Harry. McGonagall gave it to me first term. This is how I’ve been getting to my lessons all year.’ Just thought I would write in and correct Andrew’s huge mistake.”

[Andrew laughs]

“Love the Chapter-by-Chapter segments. Keep podcasting. Lots of love, Destiny.”

Andrew: She said, “little” for the record, but oopsies.

Jamie: I don’t think she did.

Andrew: No? I’m reading. It says “little.” Ben, how about the next e-mail?

Muggle Mail: Beware a Red-Headed Man

Ben: Claire, 12, from Media, Pennsylvania – is it Media or Med-e-ah? Eric?

Andrew: Media.

Ben: Is it Media?

Eric: Media.


“Hi, MuggleCasters. I just learned about MuggleCast a couple of weeks ago. I love the show, but anyway, in Episode 192, you were talking about the predictions made in Trelawney’s class, and how many of them were foreshadowing. Well, if I remember correctly, I don’t have the third book in front of me right now, when Trelawney was going around and telling people random predictions, she turned to Lavender and said, ‘Beware a redhead,’ or something like that. That is obvious foreshadowing of the Ron/Lavender relationship in ‘Half-Blood Prince.’ Just wanted to make that connection. Thanks.”

Andrew: Look at that little connection, a little foreshadowing.

Eric: Is that…

Jamie: I’ve got one on that. I don’t think it was. I think that’s a good one, but I think it’s the fox that killed her rabbit. Foxes are typically red. That’s a redhead.

Eric: Redhaired foxes.

Andrew: Oh yeah. That’s a good idea.

Ben: Or perhaps it could be both.

Andrew: Yeah.

Ben: Ooh.

Eric: I don’t get it though. Trelawney tells her to beware a redhead man, not befriend and crush on a red haired man. So I would say it’s a contradiction.

Jamie: And kiss passionately.

Andrew: Well – I mean their relationship ends up failing. So maybe that’s why Trelawney would get a prediction to tell Lavender to beware.

Eric: That’s true. That’s very true.

Jamie: Maybe, yeah.

Muggle Mail: Time Travelling

Andrew: Okay. Micah, how about you take the – Oh and by the way, we’ll discuss that a little more in Chapter-by-Chapter, coming up in a little bit.

Micah: Next e-mail from Scott, 21, from Roscoe, Illinois and he says:

“Hey guys. I was just listening to your last podcast and thought of something when you brought up the idea that Hermione is older than she should be because of using the Time Turner. I think that might not actually be the case. When they were all at the Ministry at the end of ‘Order of the Phoenix,’ there was a Death Eater that has his head fallen into a rather larger Time Turner clock. It seemed to me that as his head was traveling through time, his age was changing. The only reason that he did not travel away to an actual different time could be explained by the fact that the rest of his body was not traveling. If you take these ideas to be true, it would mean that when Hermione is traveling back in time, she is actually getting younger by the amount of time she is traveling back.”

Jamie: God, this is an age-old question, really, isn’t it.

Ben: The grandfather paradox.

Eric: Ah, that is interesting. So…

Jamie: But Ben, this isn’t the grandfather paradox.

Ben: [laughs] Whatever, it’s the same thing.

Jamie: You’re just trying to – you’re just trying to look clever, aren’t you?

Ben: Well, I mean, if you travel back to kill your grand – okay, listen. If you go back in time…

Jamie: Ben, you’re just…

Ben: No, no Jamie, Jamie, you try to sound British all the time, so just shut up.

[Jamie laughs]

Ben: Okay…

Eric: His head is shrinking, that’s – he’s becoming a baby.

Ben: It’s not possible! Because then if you traveled back before you were born, what would you do? You’d rebirth into a sperm cell?

Eric: You’d be nothing. You would be nothing.

Ben: Like, come on.

Jamie: But Ben, you just – I just raked something out, and you’re like, [in smart voice] “Hmmm, the Eisenhower paradox.”

[Andrew and Ben laugh]

Ben: Sophistication.

Andrew: Well, Jamie, what do you think about this?

Jamie: It’s so hard to get your head around time travel and stuff…

Andrew: Yeah, it is.

Jamie: It honestly could be anything. I guess it depends what theory you believe in on why time travel happens.

Eric: Well, it’s an interesting catch, too. I mean, it’s a catch because it is not a contradiction, but I mean it’s interesting. Because it’s a different observance of time. But I still think – I stand by that time is relative, and so when someone’s traveling through time they do not age. Though those around them do. That’s my argument. But…

Andrew: Episode 59, from October 14, 2006, is when we did an episode focusing on time travel. Also, I wanted to let everyone know we’ve been bringing up the Parallels Episode. We’ve been mentioning it a lot and we always reference that episode. Micah and I looked into it and it’s Episode 114. That’s when we went into all the parallel stuff, and we did – we talked about it a little more on the following episode, Episode 115, based on some listener e-mails. So if you want to hear our discussion on that, it was a great episode. I’ll add it to the Wall of Fame this week. Check out that episode, Episode 114, from September 24, 2007. And the following episode, Episode 115. So there you go.

MuggleCast 193 Transcript (continued)

Muggle Mail: Miss Know-it-All

Andrew: And the final e-mail today comes from Steph, 19, of Melbourne, Australia. She writes:

“Hi, MuggleCasters. I’ve just got a comment/question about Chapter Five, ‘Prisoner of Azkaban.’ Just after the Dementor leaves and Lupin goes to see the driver, Harry asks Hermione what happened. She says, among other things, ‘Lupin muttered something and a silvery thing shot out of his wand, and it turned around and sort of glided away.’ Don’t you think that Hermione would know what a Patronus is? Just something that has been bothering me. Keep up the great work.”

Jamie: That is true, yeah. That is very true.

Andrew: Yeah, I mean Miss Know-it-All. But I think from a reader’s perspective, Jo didn’t want to give away what that was just yet. She wanted to keep people wondering for a little bit, maybe.

Ben: Or…

Eric: Well it’s interesting too, because I’ve – when I read this, I read it as, “Doesn’t she know what Lupin’s Patronus is?” So I was like, “Oh well, you know, doesn’t she – didn’t she recognize the form that it took?”

Jamie: I guess it must have been later, though. It must have been.

Ben: I mean, just because Hermione’s read a lot of books doesn’t mean she knows everything.

Andrew: Well, obviously.

Eric: Yeah, and I mean, I found the opposite to be interesting. When people started asking Harry, “Oh, is it true you can produce a full Patronus?” I didn’t think the other students would know about it, because Harry learned about it because Lupin took him aside and gave him special – it’s not like they read about it…

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: …in class or anything.

Andrew: I think – it also could be that they’re in this tiny little compartment, and these Dementors are coming into the compartment, and crap’s blowing around – it’s getting really dark. It may have been hard to make out what Lupin was actually doing. I mean, sure, the Patronus may have been bright, but still, it may have been a little difficult to see.

Eric: Well, I mean, thirteen-year-olds aren’t supposed to know what Patronuses are, I guess. To be honest. So…

Andrew: Yeah. So it’s too above them.

Eric: Because they’re not supposed to deal with Dementors, either. So…

Chapter-by-Chapter Intro Competition

Andrew: It’s time now for a Chapter-by-Chapter, Chapter 7 through 9 of Prisoner of Azkaban. You guys may remember that last week I asked – I issued a Listener Challenge. That we need a segment intro. That we need a – actually Eric suggested that we need a segment intro for the show. So I asked listeners to come up with something. I’ll come up with one eventually, but this first one – Kurt submitted this one. I have not played this yet, so this is going to be a surprise for all of us! Let’s hear Kurt’s intro for Chapter-by-Chapter!

[A robotic-like Chapter-by Chapter-intro plays]

Andrew: Ah!

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: Look at that. It’s robotic!

Eric: That is awesome!

[Andrew laughs]

Eric: I feel like we have Kevin Steck in our midst! That’s awesome, thank you Kurt!

Andrew: Thank you, Kurt, and send in your own Chapter-by-Chapter intro, to andrew at staff dot mugglenet dot com.

Eric: But you have to top that one…

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: …and that one was pretty cool! The typewriter going!

Andrew: Yeah, send it as an attachment. It was like Jo’s typing the book away. We’re going Chapter-by-Chapter.

[Micah laughs]

Andrew: Okay, so Eric’s going to take Chapter 7, I’m going to take Chapter 8 – in terms of leading the discussion, of course, it’s going to be a wonderful group discussion. And Micah’s got Chapter 9. So go ahead, Eric!

Chapter-by-Chapter: “The Boggart in the Wardrobe”

Eric: Alright! Well, Chapter 7 is titled “The Boggart in the Wardrobe,” and it begins with – it begins at Potions class, the day following the attack – Malfoy getting attacked by Buckbeak. And he – Malfoy stumbles into the Potions dungeon, putting on a show, and swaggers over to his table, and Pansy Parkinson makes this show of proclaiming loudly, “Oh, Draco, are you okay?” And Draco is limping to the table, and it’s a bit interesting, because I was thinking ahead, and I wanted to mention how Draco and Pansy kind of interact, and it seems like Pansy is always there when he’s trying to cause Harry some grief. But to no avail, we know Draco ends up with someone else entirely who isn’t Pansy Parkinson, and I just wanted to comment – what do you think Pansy’s motives are throughout the series? Do you think she really wanted to be with Draco, and he just wasn’t seeing it? Or…

Jamie: I think it could just be the power thing, she sees him as powerful, and she just likes him. I don’t know. I think it’s genuine. She seems to always like being around him, but then there is that thing, I think it’s Half-Blood Prince just before Draco stamps on Harry’s face when he says something like – I don’t know, and she smirks like she’s pleased that he likes her or something and she’s stroking his hair. I can’t remember exactly what, but I think she does like him.

Eric: Yeah.

Andrew: I always saw it just as a little crush thing. Possibly friends with benefits. It may be one of those things that it would be cool to hear Jo reveal later on. Oh yes! Draco and Pansy, they were very smitten with each other. They shared a lot of time privately…

Ben: And called each other “bottom.”

[Andrew laughs]

Andrew: In the Slytherin Common Room.

Eric: Yeah, it seems like by the time Book 6 comes around, Draco’s got this mission from Voldemort to do, so…

Andrew: Yeah, he’s sort of – he’s sort of over girls at that point. Which is weird! It would have been great to see Draco into some girls!

Eric: Well, he does run around with Crabbe and Goyle as 11-year-old girls.

[Everyone laughs]

Andrew: You’re saying they’re 11-year-old girls?

Eric: That’s canon. That is canon, ladies and gentlemen.

Andrew: That’s an interesting speculation.

Ben: I mean, I couldn’t really see – I mean, the books are written through Harry’s perspective, so, it would be kind of weird if all of a sudden there was a chapter in the middle that was – let’s just go to the Common Room, the Slytherin Common Room.

[Andrew laughs]

Jamie: See whats going on down there.

Ben: And things would get hot and heavy between Draco and Pansy.

Andrew: [laughs] Yeah, maybe Harry could catch them snogging in the hallway. But anyway, go ahead.

Eric: Yeah. Okay. So next point, they’re in Potions class and of course Malfoy gets Snape to get Ron and Harry to help him with his potions because his arm is all messed up, and so Snape gets Ron and Harry to help Malfoy, and during all this Neville is ruining his own potion. They’re making Shrinking Solution. And what I thought was awesome is that knowing that Snape is the Half-Blood Prince, he’s able to tell Neville exactly where he went wrong, basically, and this comes from I guess being a Potions Master long enough, and he’s making Ron re-cut the roots he mashed and all this stuff, and I can’t just help but thinking – I mean Snape is being really cruel to Gryffindor, and this is early on in the series. So we don’t yet see Snape as a dramatic character. We really just see him as this big jerk. And that’s really interesting to see Snape be a villain to the Gryffindors.

Micah: Yeah. I mean, he’s absolutely terrible in these chapters. I mean, to the point of just being evil. And there’s really no need for it, and he does that a lot – where he’ll pair Ron and Harry up with Draco or have him – or have those two help Draco out, and there’s really no need for it. I mean it’s just – he makes it unbearable at points. His character, anyway.

Eric: Yeah. I mean he also in this chapter threatens, I mean – when Neville messes up his Shrinking Solution – well, we’ll feed it to your toad. We’ll feed it to Trevor and see if – see how it happens, and he even says at one point that if it fails, it will be poison to the toad. And luckily Hermione could covertly help Neville.

Ben: But is he really being that cruel, or is he just trying to challenge his students to get it right?

Eric: When he picks on Neville, he’s being cruel.

Ben: Then maybe Neville needs to be picked on.

Andrew: He needs to toughen up.

Ben: Yeah, he needs to step his game up. He’s probably producing all these subpar potions, and…

Jamie: Grow some balls.

Eric: Do you think Neville is the really cool, dangerous go-getter that he is in Book 7 – that we see because Snape and – and all these teachers said that he didn’t have what it takes as he…

Jamie: Probably partly, but it’s more just his life and stuff. He’s been depressed since his parents were in the thing, and he was kind of a break-out character. He had to do something pretty cool.

Eric: So anyways still during Potions class while Harry and Ron are working on Malfoy’s potion, Draco says, “If it were me, I’d want revenge.” He’s talking about Sirius Black because they’ve – he’s been sighted somewhere. And this really confused me for a minute, because the whole wizarding world at this point in the series believes that Sirius Black led to the Potters’ downfall – that he was actually on Voldemort’s side, but Draco is the son of Lucius who’s a – who’s a Death Eater, and my question is would the Death Eaters have known if Sirius wasn’t actually on their side, or if things had gone differently, would Sirius have been able to later on infiltrate the Death Eaters, because he’s got this reputation for being such a Voldemort supporter.

Ben: Do you think that all of the Death Eaters are aware of who’s – who exactly is on their side or do you think…

Jamie: No, of course they’re not.

Ben: So, then in that case, Lucius may not have known – he may have just figured, “Oh it turns out Black was working for us all along – kind of thing.

Jamie: I don’t think anyone knew apart from those two – the fact that they switched last minute – hardly anyone knew first of all. And when there was such a who-ha about who Snape was working for I doubt anyone really knew who was working for, and in these situations where there is a dictator or whatever and there’s fear and stuff, you really don’t know who’s working for who – anyone doesn’t, so I doubt that’s a big, big thing.

Micah: Yeah, I think the bigger issue in all this is that Harry doesn’t know and he’s one of the few who don’t – doesn’t know that Black killed his parents or at least that’s – gave the information away that led to the death of his parents. He has no idea and even somebody like Draco who’s his own age knows the story and yet Harry doesn’t and I think that’s kind of messed up in a way.

Eric: Yeah.

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: And it’s such a – and I guess I was questioning, too because I guess Peter Pettigrew – you know, many people, you’re right, Jamie, they don’t know about this specific Shield Charm that he was the Secret-Keeper because Fudge says as much later, but at the same time Sirius Black is synonymous with the Potters’ demise almost, so it’s very interesting to see Draco saying this when in fact it’s – I wondered how much that could actually benefit Sirius if he had needed to infiltrate the Ministry before the events of Book Three. I don’t know, I was a little confused but anyway, moving on. Snape, when all this – they leave Potions class, basically Hermione was able to help Neville with his potion and Snape takes five points from Gryffindor. I don’t think we’ve ever brought this up on the show before, but when a teacher just says “Five points from Gryffindor,” we are to assume that that actually happens, that Gryffindor House loses five points. In Book 4 there – it’s said that there is actually hourglasses that have jewels in them that show how many points each House has at any point…

Andrew: Right.

Eric: …during the year.

Andrew: We see them in the movies, too, in the Great Hall.

Eric: Really?

Andrew: Yeah. Go back and…

Eric: Are you sure those weren’t just…?

Andrew: No, I’m positive.

Eric: Are they in every movie or…?

Andrew: Yeah, every movie, Great Hall. If you’re looking at the teachers’ – you know, their little riser up there, if you look to the right, it’s back there in that corner. It’s pretty big.

Eric: I thought it was in the Entrance Hall and not the Great Hall. Maybe that’s a…

Andrew: Well, in the movie it’s in the Great Hall.

Eric: Oh, cool. Well…

Andrew: Maybe it’s different in the book.

Eric: Yeah. So when a teacher just says “Five points from Gryffindor,” is that like a nonverbal spell? Do you guys – how do you guys think that works?

Ben: Well, they say it, it would be verbal.

[Everyone laughs]

Eric: Well, I mean like a wandless magic.

Andrew: Yeah, it’s some sort of – I would think like the castle’s enchanted and whenever it hears it…

Ben: Or maybe – this whole point system is a bit ridiculous because there’s no, like it’s really arbitrary, you know.

Andrew: No, but you know what, I was thinking about it and it’s the only way you can enforce students at the school.

Ben: What are you talking about?

Andrew: Because for example…

Ben: The only way? Come on!

Andrew: Because when – what else? Okay, detention – that’s another way. But when Harry does something wrong, when Snape detracts – takes away points it really gets to them because it affects their House as a whole. So they want to stay in line or else they’re going to affect their entire class.

Ben: Right, but it’s stupid. I could be like, “Oh, one hundred points to Gryffindor…”

Andrew: But…

Ben: “Good answer, fifty points.”

Andrew: They keep it within reason. There seems to be some sort of guidelines that they follow.

Eric: It’s true, though. But then Lupin later on in the chapter does give five points to everyone who tackled the boggart. So that’s like all of Gryffindor just gains sixty points. So it is subjective, but at the same time it’s not, you know. So that was my question with that. So we get to meet Professor Lupin finally. It’s Defense Against the Dark Arts in the afternoon. Hermione’s done some time traveling and stuff in the chapter. Lupin enters and greets his first class, and it’s remarked that he looks like he’s had a few square meals since the event of the train which makes me laugh because knowing he’s a werewolf, what did he eat? [laughs sarcastically] But they head off to…

Andrew and Eric: What did he eat?

Micah and Eric: Small children.

Andrew: Oh, oh my.

Eric: Get it?

Jamie: The tears of small children, more specifically.

[Andrew and Eric laugh]

Eric: So they head off to the staff room, and on the way they meet Peeves the Poltergeist. And Harry makes this note here that Peeves usually respects teachers. But then at first – when it comes to Lupin, Lupin greets him and says, “I wouldn’t do that if I were you,” sticking gum in a hole or something, in a keyhole. And Peeves at first ignores him and then begins singing a song about him, “Loony, loony Lupin”.

Jamie: Yeah.

Eric: And it’s interesting because I wanted to guess since Lupin had been at Hogwarts as a kid, I wonder if Lupin and Peeves know each other, have a back story?

Andrew: They got to know each other. I mean, certainly they know of each other.

Eric: But specifically, I mean, because Lupin was a pretty special case back in Hogwarts, you know.

Andrew: Yeah, yeah.

Eric: And that song he sings, you know, saying “Loony Lupin”. Loony is from the moon, so it’s like…

Andrew: Right, right. Yeah, I bet he knows what’s up.

Eric: Yeah, so that was…

Andrew: In regards to the whole werewolf thing.

Eric: Oh, we never really got – did we get Peeves resolved at all in Book Seven? I can’t remember.

Andrew: There’s a lot of open-ended questions….

Micah: I’m sure he was part of the battle.

Andrew: …that still remain.

Eric: Okay.

Micah: I don’t remember to be honest, but…

Andrew: Yeah, I think he was mentioned. I think I remember hearing him mentioned.

Micah: Did the directors or the producers ever mention why they didn’t put him in the movies?

Eric: I think expenses.

Jamie: No, it wasn’t. It was Rik Mayall, or however you say his name, was going to do it, but then he had a contractual disagreement, I think…

Andrew: Really?

Jamie: …so they didn’t put him in in the end. Yeah, pretty sure it was that.

Andrew: Well, they could have replaced the actor, couldn’t they?

Jamie: Well, true. Yeah, yeah, that’s true.

Eric: Huh, maybe it was one of those coin tosses.

Andrew: I think it’s another stupid time thing. I mean, they have some ghosts in there. How many ghosts do they need?

Eric: Yeah.

Jamie: Yeah that’s true.

Andrew: Go ahead.

Eric: Yeah. Anyway, so they get into the staff room. Well, first Lupin shows off and hits Peeves with gum. And then they get into the staff room, Snape is in there. [laughs] Seems like after he tortures Gryffindors, he likes to have a long cup of tea in the staff room. And we meet – Lupin introduces them to a boggart, which is – according to Lupin, boggarts like wardrobes, the gap under beds, and the cupboards under sinks. And I wanted to mention that with this introduction of a fantastic creature like boggarts, Jo Rowling has provided a magical answer to a sink that would make noise, the monster in the closet, and monster-under-the-bed Muggle experiences. So if Muggles have, “Oh, I have a monster under my bed,” it could be a boggart.

Andrew: I think they’re kind of perverted. They’re always hiding in places where they can see you naked.

[Eric laughs]

Jamie: Yeah, that’s true. Yeah.

Eric: Well, there’s no boggart in the shower. [laughs]

Andrew: No, the cupboard under the sink, that could be by a shower.

[Eric laughs]

Jamie: Yeah, that’s true.

Eric: But boggarts, [laughs] boggarts are really cool creatures. And I really like that tie-in to the real world, you know, because who hasn’t thought there was a monster under their bed or in the closet.

Andrew: Right, right.

Eric: Yeah. So anyway, they face off. They get the boggarts and it’s pretty much verbatim in the movie as well. But Lupin doesn’t choose Harry and Harry feels guilty. You know, Harry is like – when Lupin is first describing the boggart, Harry is like, “Oh great! What’s going to happen? I’m going to have to think about Voldemort and Voldemort’s going to show up,” or then he gets the image of the Dementor. Well, anyway it comes time for Harry – Harry is like next in line to face the boggart and Lupin stops – the whole class shouts at the boggart, “Here!” and confuses the boggart. Boggart changes into a moon, or a silvery orb in the books, and Lupin defuses it and that’s the end of class. So Hermione and Harry don’t get a chance at the boggart, and this is addressed later – Harry asks Lupin why and he says why. But Hermione doesn’t get chosen. What do you guys think Hermione’s boggart would have been?

Andrew: Well, why doesn’t she get chosen? Is it just the line order and Lupin wanted to stop it before – you know, anyone after Harry is screwed? I mean, I thought that was a bit ridiculous.

Eric: Yeah, because you added this question in there, Andrew, you were like…

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: You know, why doesn’t Hermione get, you know, chosen?

Ben: Doesn’t Hermione encounter a boggart in Book Five and it’s McGonagall telling her that she failed every class?

Eric: That was – no, that was the end of Book Three. That’s the final exam, isn’t it? That’s just the final exam of Book Three…

Jamie: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Eric: …when they’re running through the tires, yeah. You’re right, though.

Jamie: But I think that just kind of signposts how serious the book gets, because that’s such a – sorry Hermione, but a crap boggart, you know, like…

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: Yeah, it is.

Jamie: And then I’m sure she wouldn’t see that in Book Four, Five, Six and Seven. I’m sure she would see something a bit more serious.

Andrew: Although, it kind of bothered me, because some of the other boggarts were a bit ridiculous, too. I mean – I can’t remember them off-hand right now, but I was just reading them and thinking, like what is this? Like this is really their – the thing that they’re scared of most?

Jamie: Yeah.

Eric: Well, Seamus is scared of banshees. I mean, that’s pretty creepy.

Jamie: That’s pretty specific, like…

Andrew: Yeah, I guess.

Eric: Yeah.

Jamie: …way too specific, a banshee.

Andrew: Yeah. Somebody was scared of a rat. Like is that really their biggest fear, rats?

Jamie: But I think you need to avoid the whole “family dying and bad stuff happening.” Because you can’t really have that in a boggart. I mean, you can, because Mrs. Weasley sees it, but that’s such a cop-out, because if you ask anyone, “What is your boggart?” then they’re going to be like, “Oh, it’s seeing everything going wrong and my family dying and people dear to me.” You know, I…

Andrew: Mhm.

Jamie: I guess you have to go over that and say what you’re actually most scared of – mystical beings and stuff like that, because…

Ben: Right, and when you think of something like rats, does it necessarily have to mean like literally rats, or could it be like, the symbolic…

Jamie: Yeah. And also, don’t forget…

Ben: …you know, what a rat is?

Jamie:1984 as well. Rats are very significant in that, if you’ve read that.

Andrew: Yeah, and I guess that Jo also maybe wanted to keep it comical.

Eric: And Lupin explains it as – Harry says “but I didn’t do anything,” and then he says that “you and Hermione answered my questions at the beginning of class.” So they did get something – they still, both of them, did get five points, even though both of them have not participated with the boggart just yet. Second to last note of the chapter, Lupin’s boggart is described in the book as a “silvery orb” which Parvati Patil wonders loudly why it is a crystal ball that Lupin is afraid of. This is one of those things which I wish they had done better in the movie, which leads to my next point, really. That it’s described as a silvery orb, it’s kind of very ambiguous at this point, obviously, in the book that Lupin is a werewolf. But in the movie when it comes time for Lupin to jump in front of Harry and change his boggart into the moon, it’s very clearly the moon, with parting clouds and stars in the sky.

[Andrew laughs]

Eric: You guys remember this?

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: This was ridiculous. There’s no mistaking that it’s the moon in the movie.

Andrew: Right. Well, obviously I think they wanted to make it clear in the movie, to start giving people some very clear hints of what Lupin actually is.

Micah: They do that a lot, though. If you look at what happens in Goblet of Fire with Mad-Eye Moody or impostor Moody, he’s swigging from that flask every five minutes.

Eric: Yeah. And the lightning – remember when he comes in the Great Hall for the first time and the lightning strikes?

Andrew: Yeah.

[Eric laughs]

What Would Your Boggart Be?

Andrew: Okay, so before we get into the next chapter, I have a question for all of you. Actually this question comes from Josh Boulton of the U.K. He says:

“Hey guys, if each of the hosts had to face a boggart what would it have turned into?”

Ben? Your boggart?

Ben: What would it have been?

Jamie: And Ben, let’s go away from the whole family dying, bad stuff happening thing.

Andrew: Yeah, keep it light, but be serious, though.

Jamie: Go for nightmare stuff, you know…

Ben: That there would never – that I’d refresh my iTunes feed and there would never be a new episode of MuggleCast.

Andrew: Awww!

[Jamie and Eric laugh]

Andrew: I don’t know how that turns into a boggart.

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: I guess you could get a free iMac out of it. [laughs] Jamie, how about you?

Jamie: Well, have you guys ever seen The Neverending Story?

Ben: Oh, yeah.

Micah: That dog-like thing?

Jamie: Yeah, Gmork. Do you remember Gmork, the werewolfy vampire type thing?

Andrew: Yeah.

Jamie: I had about four million bad dreams about him when I was a child. My girlfriend did as well – that must be a match made in heaven.

[Andrew and Eric laugh]

Ben: [in British accent] “Two bottoms.”

Jamie: Yes, exactly Ben. But yeah, it would be that, just coming at me from all angles, and – oh yeah…

Andrew: I have a similar one to that actually. My dad had a miniature, not mini – I guess it was like two feet tall Groucho Marx statue in the basement. I would never go in the basement alone because I was scared crapless of that thing. So I think if one of those things – that’s probably still my greatest fear deep down, like it coming to life [laughs] because I used to be so scared of it. Eric?

Eric: I think you guys can back me up on this, having been there. I think my boggart would probably be Ben using my razor to shave.

[Andrew laughs]

Ben: Yes. I convinced…

[Everyone laughs]

Eric: Just Ben with that grin on his face.

Ben: I had this…

Eric: Halfway through shaving his beard, some shaving cream on the mirror, just looking at me and grinning.

Ben: Because I had this scab on my face and I told Eric that I shaved the scab with his razor.

Andrew: Ew!

Ben: And yeah. He started crying.

Andrew: And Micah, lastly.

Micah: I think it’s along the same lines and you and Jamie with – the guy who always creeped me out was – and actually we had him on the show – who plays the Leprechaun. That character, though used to creep the hell out of me.

Ben: Warwick Davis!

Eric: You know what? You’re right.

Jamie: Yeah, Ben. I agree that was terrifying when he jumped up and down on that guy’s barn…

[Micah laughs]

Jamie: …and sung that song. Yeah, that was horrible, the Leprechaun.

Chapter-by-Chapter: “Flight of the Fat Lady”

Andrew: All right, well thanks, Josh for that e-mail. Let’s get in now to Chapter 8, “Flight of the Fat Lady.” The students take a liking to Lupin because of his great class lessons, but on the other hand, Hagrid’s classes get lame because he lost confidence after the hippogriff incident. So Harry enters the start of the Quidditch season with a pep talk by Oliver Wood to the team and they all tell each other how amazing they are. And Oliver is particularly…

Ben: That’s kind of like an episode of MuggleCast.

[Everyone laughs]

Andrew: Ben, you were great today!

Eric: No, I made you! No, you made…

[Andrew laughs]

Eric: Yeah, you made me! Yeah.

Andrew: And Oliver is particularly motivated to win this year because it’s his final year at Hogwarts and he hasn’t won the House Cup yet, so he really wants to win it…

Ben: Quidditch Cup, Andrew.

Andrew: Quidditch Cup. Quidditch, House, whatever. Quidditch Cup.

Ben: House Cup’s different.

Andrew: You’re right. Sorry. You’re absolutely right. So Harry comes back from practice one day and learns that the first Hogsmeade trip is on Halloween, and Harry gets upset and decides he’ll ask McGonagall if he can go. But before that, we have another round of Scabbers vs. Crookshanks. I think we sort of kicked off this little running joke last week. So what is this, round three or four?

Micah: Three.

Andrew: [laughs] So round three, it starts off with Ron. He doesn’t approve of Crookshanks bringing a large, dead spider into the common room to eat in front of him. So out of nowhere, Crookshanks pounces on Ron’s bag where Scabbers is sleeping inside. Ron says to Hermione, “There’s something funny about that animal,” referring to Crookshanks. But I found that kind of ironic in that there’s actually something wrong with Scabbers. But does Crookshanks sense that Scabbers is not a real rat? Like why does he keep going after him?

Ben: Yes. Yes, because he’s been talking to Sirius. Crookshanks has been talking to Sirius in his dog form, and he has told – Sirius has communicated to Crookshanks that Scabbers is not really a rat and is Peter Pettigrew.

Andrew: Oh! Is this in the books?

Ben: Yes, it is.

Andrew: Wow, I feel – go ahead, Eric.

Eric: Jo has confirmed that Crookshanks is also a Kneazle and so Crookshanks can tell the difference between if something’s an animal or an Animagi like a person inside.

Andrew: Oooh!

Eric: So that’s why I thought, not even Sirius talking to Crookshanks – but you’re right. That obviously has happened and it is in that book. Crookshanks knows that there’s something off about Scabbers even in the pet shop when he jumps on Ron’s head because Ron’s standing there trying to get Scabbers some tonic or something and Crookshanks jumps on his head and that’s because – I think that Crookshanks being a Kneazle, being a cat with some magical powers…

Andrew: Right.

Eric: …it’s able to know that Scabbers is actually not all he seems to be, so I think there is just this innate ability for Crookshanks to say that Scabbers is not normal and to hate him and chase him because of that.

Andrew: And it sort of draws into my parallel that I was drawing last week about the Hermione and Ron relationship sort of paralleling Crookshanks and Scabbers in that they both sort of [laughs] fight with each other.

Eric: Yeah.

Andrew: So moving on, before Transfiguration we see Lavender Brown crying outside a classroom. Lavender has learned that a rabbit, Binky, has died. She received an owl from her family about it that morning and today’s the sixteenth of October and as Lavender points out, Trelawney had made a prediction for Lavender which said, “That thing you’re dreading, it will happen on the sixteenth of October.” Now Hermione, being a very smart student, is skeptical of this, of Trelawney and her predictions, and points out that a) Binky didn’t actually die today, she only received the owl today and b) Lavender could not have been dreading Binky’s death as Binky is only a baby. So do you guys think this was an accurate prediction – like was it legitimate or did she just get really lucky, Trelawney?

Ben: It wasn’t legitimate. I mean, I think anything could of happened that day and I think that whole point of that happening was to further affirm Hermione’s skepticism of that whole branch of magic.

Andrew: Mhm.

Ben: ..that whole branch of magic.

Andrew: And in this area Ron is also still P.O.’ed about the latest Crookshanks attack. So he tells Lavender not to listen to Hermione because Hermione doesn’t care about other people’s pets. [laughs]

Eric: [laughs] See, I’m going to write a complaint letter to Hogwarts, though. Who separates the young Gryffindor girl from her pet baby bunny? Honestly! Why couldn’t Lavender have taken Binky to Hogwarts? Is it only an…

Andrew: Because they smell!

Eric: …owl, or a cat, or a toad?

[Micah laughs]

Eric: Come on, a toad? Really, they’re old-fashioned. They need to let rabbits into Hogwarts. I think that…

Andrew: I don’t know…

Eric: I think that needs to happen.

Andrew: So after Transfiguration, Harry attempts to get Professor McGonagall’s permission to go to Hogsmeade but she says no, as a parent or guardian must sign it for him. And this is one of those plot points in the series that makes the readers feel bad for Harry because he’s being left out of a group event because he has crappy guardians, and that must suck. So at this point, I think first-time readers realize that Harry will definitely find another way.

Ben: I don’t get why – why wouldn’t Harry just forge the signature? I mean…

Eric: Well…

Ben: …that’s what I used to do.

Eric: …doesn’t somebody offer for Harry and then he already – he says he already told professor McGonagall that he…

Andrew: That’s exactly right.

Jamie: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Eric: Yeah, okay. But at the same time, yeah. Harry is just being honest that his uncle and his aunt – I thought that this response was a cop-out. I mean, obviously, they don’t want Harry leaving the castle because Hogsmeade is less protected than Hogwarts and it’s very dangerous with Sirius Black on the run. So, I thought that – honestly, this whole “needs to be a parent or a guardian” thing was kind of crap.

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: The Head of his house, you know, should – I mean, how did Voldemort do it? Voldemort was an orphan. Did he ever go to Hogsmeade?

Andrew: McGonagall should have just said straight up “No, you can’t go because it’s not safe at Hogsmeade.” Simple as that.

Eric: And then draw suspicion.

Andrew: Or, “I’ll sign it if I can be with you the whole time, or Dumbledore can.” I don’t know.

Eric: Exactly. What about chaperones, huh?

Andrew: Yeah. Yeah, there you go.

Eric: Hagrid would do that.

Andrew: Hagrid would. Moving along…

Ben: [imitating Harry] “He was their friend!”

Andrew: Jamie, did you want to make a point now?

Jamie: Oh no, I was just going to say about the previous one, about the rabbit. You said they can’t be allowed in Hogwarts because they smell. Well, in seven books you don’t ever see any student wash once. So…

[Everyone laughs]

Eric: You see Harry.

Jamie: …I don’t think a rabbit is going to be a problem.

Eric: Harry does take a bath.

Jamie: Oh yeah, you see him in the – yeah, only because he has to open an egg.

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: Well – right.

Jamie: That’s the only reason he’s in the bath.

Andrew: [laughs] They only wash if they have to figure out what’s next in the Triwizard Tournament.

Ben: Do you remember that article that came out a long time ago, that was like, “Take a Shower, Harry”?

Eric: We’ve mentioned this before.

Andrew: Yeah. [laughs] All right, so moving along, Halloween arrives and the students go to Hogsmeade. And while Harry mopes around the castle, he ends up running into Lupin who takes him to his office for tea…

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: Harry asks Lupin why he didn’t let Harry go up against the Boggart. And Lupin explains he thought it would turn in to Voldemort. Harry says it would have become a Dementor. And there’s a good line from Lupin here, “That suggests that what you fear most of all, is fear. Very wise, Harry.”

Ben: He totally ripped that off from FDR.

[Andrew and Eric laugh]

Andrew: So Snape enters while Harry and Lupin are talking to deliver a potion for Lupin. And after Snape, who is looking very worried at the situation, leaves, Lupin tells Harry that he’s been feeling a bit off-color, so that’s why Snape brewed him a potion. And I assume by feeling off-color, he means he’s feeling like he wants to howl!

Eric: Or imprint.

Andrew: Or imprint! The kids return from Hogsmeade, and Ron delivers some brilliantly colored sweets into Harry’s lap. Ron and Hermione…

Ben: They’re not just sweets, they’re “brilliantly colored.”

Andrew: Yes. Great English writing – British writing. Ron and Hermione tell him about their trip and reading the description of Hogsmeade from Ron and Hermione got me really excited for the theme park. Because that whole two paragraphs is exactly what they’re putting in the theme park. I mean Dervish and Banges, the Owlery, Zonko’s. They’re putting all that stuff in the park it’s going to be incredible.

Ben: [whispers] Awww…

[Andrew laughs]

Eric: What about Madame Puddifoot’s?

Andrew: Maybe not that. That’s for the next one. So they head to the feast and have a great time. But after the feast ends they head back up to the dormitory, where they find that the area outside of the portrait is packed with students…

[Ben gasps]

Andrew: …who want to get into the Gryffindor common room.

Eric: [imitating Percy] “I am a prefect. Move along.”

Andrew: Percy heads to the front of the line and sees the portrait is torn up without the Fat Lady inside of it so he summons Dumbledore. And Dumbledore and Peeves show up at the same time. Peeves reveals that she ran away, having been so ashamed that Sirius Black tore up her portrait after being refused entrance to the common room! So, time for some theorizing. Why is Sirius trying to get in? Can’t he tell that everyone is down in the Great Hall? And what would be his purpose of gaining entrance, other than waiting for Harry?

Jamie: To kill Pettigrew.

Ben: To kill the rat.

Jamie: No no, to kill Pettigrew.

Andrew: But still, why is he – do you think he knew that the rat was there, or maybe Ron had him down in the Great Hall?

Ben: Yeah.

Jamie: I think he was just pretty desperate by then. He just wanted to get to him as soon as possible.

Ben: Yeah, he was malnourished, a little bit wacky.

Andrew: Yeah.

Jamie: Yeah, exactly, yeah.

Andrew: Ron had speculated – or he does speculate in the next chapter, that Sirius lost track of time and didn’t realize it was Halloween, so therefore thinking Harry would be in the tower. That’s it for Chapter 8. Now, Chapter 9, Micah Tannenbaum will wrap it up.

Micah: All right, Chapter 9.

Ben: All right, Micah, bring it home.

MuggleCast 193 Transcript (continued)

Chapter-by-Chapter: “Grim Defeat”

Micah: All right. “Grim Defeat.” So, as Andrew mentioned, all the students are sent into the Great Hall to spend the night there, and all of a sudden as you would expect with a bunch of thirteen year olds and teenagers, there are whispers: “How did Black manage to get into the castle?” And this is again showing Hermione’s intelligence, where she starts shooting down all the popular theories that are out there: “Well, he used a disguise. Well, he flew on his broomstick. Well, he Apparated.” And she keeps referencing Hogwarts: A History, which, you know, seems to be like her – she carries it everywhere she goes, or it’s her little reference guide, handbook, whatever you want to call it. So is she the only one to have read this? Does this also show that the other students just don’t pay enough attention? Or is it just that they’re too young to maybe even think: “Oh, he can’t Apparate into Hogwarts, oh, you can’t fly, because the castle’s protected by things other than just, you know – its walls.”

Jamie: It’s the fear, as well. I think everyone else is like, pretty scared, where she’s keeping calm, so she’s like, “No, no, no, you can’t do that.” I just don’t think people read the books, like…

Andrew: Yeah.

Jamie: …when I was their age, I did not read schoolbooks.

Micah: Right.

Andrew: Yeah.

Jamie: You know, I mean…

Ben: And – and History of Magic is like the most boring class. And that’s where they would probably cover anything…

Jamie: Yeah, exactly.

Ben: …about history of Hogwarts, so everyone’s sleeping through it anyways.

Eric: Yeah, they could certainly lighten it up – History of Magic. You know, why does it have to be the most boring subject of them all?

Jamie: Because it’s taught by a ghost.

Eric: Yeah. Yeah, that’s why, but it’s not – it could be really exciting.

Jamie: Yeah, true.

Micah: But Hermione is just very, very practical about it. I mean, she just – she’s like, “Well, if he was in a disguise, the Dementors would recognize – or wouldn’t be fooled by it.”

Eric: Right.

Micah: “If he was flying, he wouldn’t be able to get past the curses, or whatever charms that are on the castle. If he Apparated, it wouldn’t work, because you can’t Apparate inside Hogwarts.”

Jamie: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Micah: Unless you’re Dumbledore.

Eric: It is logic, too, like Dementors definitely aren’t in Hogwarts: A History, but – I just remembered her doing that logic puzzle, the Snape’s potion logic puzzle at the end of Book 1. You know, she’s really good with logic, so.

Micah: Yeah. All right, well, during this whole scene, we see that Percy gets left in charge as the Head Boy, and you know, we overhear a lot of conversations between him and Dumbledore, and to me it’s interesting to see his interaction with Dumbledore; he really loves the attention of those that are in positions of high authority and power and you can see that here with Dumbledore, and obviously that changes as we move on throughout the series, so I was wondering, does that make him more like Slughorn or more like Umbridge?

[Andrew laughs]

Jamie: I thought Slughorn at first, I must say.

Andrew: Really?

Jamie: Yeah, I don’t know why. But then thinking about it, I think probably a bit more like Umbridge – well I don’t know. It depends if he likes power or he just likes being able to use power to his own benefit. I think Umbridge likes the power, whereas Slughorn just likes what can come from knowing people who are in power. I guess he’s a bit of both, really.

Andrew: I mean, if we’re talking about when they all were sleeping in the Great Hall I would think Percy as being more of an Umbridge there in terms of telling people to just be quiet, that was very, I don’t know, bitchy.

Eric: Well see, we know Umbridge as having set the Dementors to attack Privet Drive, so…

Andrew: Mhm.

Eric: …it’s different from what he knows Umbridge as. Umbridge to him could be actually just a high ranking politician who got there on her own…

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: …you know, and is actually probably quite respectable.

Micah: Yeah.

Ben: But in terms of how he’s going – how he’s abusing his power – not necessarily abusing his power, but pushing the limits of it by telling people, “Oh, be quiet, be quiet.”

Eric: Yeah, yeah.

Ben: A lot of people who are in positions of power, they have so little control over so much else in their life, and if you look at the way that Percy grew up, and – you know, he’s used to being poor, etcetera, etcetera. So perhaps he was a little bit – took some liberties with the power he was given.

Micah: Yeah. I mean, he’s definitely pompous in these scenes, too. He’s interacting with the Headmaster and he wants to make it seem almost as if – at least the people around him can hear what’s going on, because his job is so important, he’s talking about Sirius Black with the Headmaster of Hogwarts. Something else that came up here that one person sent a tweet in on, thetilly, she says that:

“In Chapter Nine Percy looks abashed when Dumbledore talks about the Dementors. Is this an indication of Percy’s blind faith in the Ministry?”

And this is of course when Dumbledore makes his statement about how as long as he’s in charge of the school, no Dementor would ever cross the threshold of the castle. So again, are we getting a little insight into Percy’s character and how his relationship with the Ministry is going to be moving forward?

Andrew: Yeah, I think so.

Eric: Yeah.

Andrew: I think this is sort of a – some subtle foreshadowing, without really being foreshadowing. [laughs]

Micah: All right, and…

Andrew: It’s just a sign of his development.

Micah: …some more conversation goes on between Snape and Dumbledore and this is overheard by the trio, and we learned that Snape had voiced his disapproval of someone’s appointment at the beginning of the term, so the obvious question would be, who does he think could have been helping Black get into the castle? Now, there were two professors that were appointed at the beginning of the term: One was Lupin, the other was Hagrid. And I guess given Defense Against the Dark Art professors’ track record, he’s probably talking about Lupin.

Eric: Yeah, he’s probably talking about Lupin.

Andrew: Yeah, he doesn’t have much against Hagrid, does he? So…

Micah: Not really. So as the – after this huge incident with Black breaking into the castle, Harry starts to get more protection. He has Percy following him around in the halls, there’s a time when McGonagall calls him into her office to tell him about Sirius Black…

Andrew: [laughs] Yeah.

Micah: And she learns that he’s already aware, at least of the fact that he’s after Harry.

Andrew: Right.

Micah: Now again, this is one of the points where we could talk about – should Harry have been told who Sirius was in terms of his betrayal of his parents? I think it might have been a good time to tell him, but obviously it plays out later on in the story.

Ben: [imitating Harry] “He was their friend!”

Micah: Exactly. And even Madam Hooch has to supervise his Quidditch practice. And this – well, really quick – this goes back to what you guys were talking about in the previous chapter with respect to Hogsmeade. Why not just send somebody with him?

Andrew: Right.

Ben: Because he didn’t have the form signed, okay?

Micah: Oh, who cares?

Andrew: Well, they seem to be sticklers about that, and once they let one person get away with that, then anyone can get away with it.

Eric: [laughs] Actually…

Andrew: So I think that’s the perspective.

Eric: Actually, if you guys have ever seen 24, just one guard, just one chaperone would not have been enough. If you’re an accomplished wizard, you can get past the first guy.

Ben: He killed thirteen people!

Andrew: Yeah, man.

Ben: Twelve, or however many. Twelve.

Eric: That’s true. That’s true. They don’t know what Sirius is actually capable of. But regarding Micah’s question, I think Dumbledore should have sat down. I mean, this is so interesting that Lupin is – Lupin was one of the Potters’ friends, and he’s now a teacher at Hogwarts for this year, and the other friend of the Potters, who isn’t presumed dead – or dead, is trying to kill him – is going after Harry. This is so interesting and so personal, like unexpectedly so, that these two friends of the Potters, one of them is a teacher and the other one is out to kill Harry, presumably.

Andrew: Right.

Eric: I really think Dumbledore should at least have more of a presence in this book than he does. It’s very interesting that Dumbledore…

Andrew: That’s something we suffer from in a lot of the books, particularly Book 5 as well.

Eric: Well – and he explains why. He says, “I was wrong,” or at least…

Andrew: Yeah, yeah.

Eric: But for it to be…

Andrew: Too late, though.

Eric: For it to be McGonagall to sit Harry down…

Andrew: Right.

Eric: …is kind of cheap.

Andrew: Onward, Micah!

Micah: So later on in the chapter, Snape fills in for Lupin as Defense Against the Dark Arts teacher, and an interesting quote that he has, “Well, well, well, I’d never thought I’d meet a third year class who wouldn’t even recognize a werewolf when they saw one.”

Andrew: Oh, snap!

Ben: Ooh.

Andrew: Ooh. He was mean. He was so bitter about this position.

Micah: He was an ass. We can say “ass” on this episode, right? We said “bitch” earlier.

Andrew: Yeah, in this case, absolutely. It’s justified.

Ben: He was a slimey [bleep].

[Everyone laughs]

Eric: Can we say that, Andrew?

Micah: But there’s a lot of stuff that goes on in this class very similar to what went on in Potions in the chapter that Eric did, and he intentionally asks questions he knows that Hermione will have the answer to about werewolves, then intentionally treats her cruelly. And he really took a lot of pleasure in criticizing Lupin’s teaching style, and setting homework on them. I mean, he’s really just an insufferable ass in this chapter.

Andrew: You’re absolutely right.

Eric: I think too, it’s been so long – I mean even though the second war hasn’t really picked up yet, it’s been so long since Snape – all he remembers is – anymore – is the school days of when Lupin – or actually I think his anger – Snape’s anger really is directed at James Potter, but both Harry and Remus are the closest he’s going to actually get to James Potter, who is married to his love, too. So, it’s a big deal and that to have Lupin back and he’s a werewolf and Snape’s just causing this ruckus – you’re right, but he’s very personally affected.

Andrew: I think – well – that’s…

Jamie: He is – yeah.

Andrew: That’s a good point. They – there are some reasons – the justifications particularly about Lily and Harry, but he needs to get out and have a little fun, quite frankly. He’s one of those people who just can’t break loose of this work ethic and just doesn’t have any fun.

Micah: The last part of this chapter has to deal with the Quidditch match, and this, I guess, would be round four between Crookshanks and Scabbers.

Ben: Ding ding!

Micah: Harry wakes up on the morning of the Quidditch match…

Ben: Feeling like P. Diddy?

Micah: Feeling like P. Diddy, yeah.

[Jamie and Micah laugh]

Micah: And he notices that Crookshanks is waiting at the door, and he has to take him downstairs, and then he spends much of the morning stopping Crookshanks from getting back up into the common room to go after Scabbers.

Jamie: What a procrastinator!

[Eric laughs]

Micah: Yeah, I know, right? He should be preparing for his match. Who cares if the cat runs up?

Eric: Getting the rat…

Micah: And shredding the rat.

Andrew: It’s J.K. Rowling’s detailed world. Let it be.

Micah: So the Quidditch match approaches, and we get our first introduction to Cedric Diggory, the Hufflepuff captain, and…

Eric: Part-time vampire.

Micah: …obviously, he…

Jamie: Yeah.

Micah: …plays a role a little bit later on in the series. Interesting how Jo places these characters early on. I think we also, later on in this book, hear about Cho Chang…

Andrew: And Cedric’s kind of described in the book when he’s introduced as sort of like a bigger guy, which Robert Pattinson in the movie is not. [laughs] He’s a bit scrawny…

Eric: He’s tall – he’s taller – he comes down from a tree.

Andrew: He is tall.

Eric: I mean, he just…

Andrew: Yes.

Eric: He jumps down from the tree. That’s his intro.

Jamie: How tall is he? He’s not that tall, is he, Robert…

Andrew: I don’t…

Jamie: …Pattinson.

Andrew: …know.

Ben: He’s probably 5’11”.

Andrew: He’s taller than Dan, but Dan is short.

Eric: Yeah.

Andrew: So…

Jamie: Dan’s…

Andrew: …that’s…

Jamie: …5’7, isn’t he?

Andrew: [laughs] Yeah.

Jamie: Or 5’6.

Andrew: He’s pretty short like that.

Jamie: Dan is tiny.

Ben: Doesn’t Dan…

Micah: So, the…

Ben: …look like a lizard?

Andrew: Yes. We’ll discuss that after the show.

Ben: Okay.

[Andrew and Jamie laugh]

Micah: The Quidditch match arrives, and Harry is flying around and it’s a really nasty day out. And all of a sudden, he sees the Grim in the sky.

Andrew: Mhm.

Micah: So I was wondering, was he forced into thinking this, based on everything that’s happened previously with seeing Sirius on Privet Drive, and then the Grim on the cover of the book in Flourish and Blotts, the Grim in his teacup? Is that – there’s so much going on that – making you think that you’re seeing things.

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: Yeah, well, I’m so confused because Sirius is actually at this Quidditch match and he is in the stands. And so Harry, when he’s falling, sees the dog, actually physically sees the dog. But in the movie, the clouds part and there’s a Grim in the sky. Is that how it was in the book? I forget. Was there actually a Grim…

Jamie: No, no. He sees him in the stands. He…

Andrew: Right.

Eric: So there’s no Grim in the sky like there is in the movie, right?

Andrew: Right.

Jamie: No…

Eric: In the book.

Jamie: …it’s kind of like…

Micah: No…

Jamie: …the face…

Micah: …it’s both…

Jamie: …of Satan…

Micah: …I thought.

Jamie: …in the Twin Towers.

Andrew: But I think Micah’s right. He’s so used to seeing the Grim at this point he almost sort of expects it. So it’s, like, “Awww, go figure. Of course I see it here too.”

Eric: Yeah.

Micah: Yeah.

Eric: It’s just so interesting to see because – I mean, this time Sirius – is it Sirius, or is it Malfoy and Crabbe and Goyle? Because they do that too. Pretend…

Micah: No.

Eric: …to be…

Micah: This is when he’s actually attacked by the dementors.

Eric: Pretending to be dementors. But the actual dementors are there. But Sirius wanted to catch Harry at Quidditch, wanted to see him do Quidditch. And as a result, Harry trips out and sees the Grim.

Andrew: Right.

Eric: So, I mean, there – it’s just…

Micah: Right.

Eric: …interesting that sometimes it’s actually a black dog, and the other times it’s this mythical Grim, either in its teacup or on the book. And yeah, you’re right, Micah. I mean, he’s – Harry’s being constantly reminded of his impending death and it’s really an issue.

Micah: Mhm.

Andrew: All right.

Micah: So, because it’s the dementors that actually attack him, and he begins to, I guess, learn more about what started on the train with all the screaming and things like that. And we’re – I think we’re probably able to – at this point in the series if we’re reading it for the first time, to figure out that it’s actually a conversation between Voldemort and Lily Potter. And the big thing I thought that was revealed here was that Lily is actually offered to be spared by Voldemort because he tells her to stand aside. And that caused a lot of speculation, I thought, early on, right? Before the other books were being released. “Who was Lily to Voldemort?” “What did she mean?” “What was her occupation?” was another big thing that would cause her to even have the opportunity to be spared.

Eric: That’s interesting, yeah.

Andrew: Yeah. Hmmm.

Micah: So…

Andrew: Good point.

Micah: And then just to wrap up the chapter, the dementors cause Harry to fall from close to 50 feet in the air. We learn…

Andrew: Nooo!

Micah: …Dumbledore – and they do this in the movie. He kind of makes it so that Harry doesn’t have…

Jamie: Die.

Micah: …full impact…

[Everyone laughs]

Micah: …onto the ground. [laughs]

Andrew: Yeah, die.

Eric: Thud! Oh well, there’s the series.

Micah: So, Dumbledore is enraged at what happened, and we learn from Hermione that he [laughs] shot silver stuff at them.

Andrew: Ooh.

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: [as Dumbledore] “How dare you?! Take my silver stuff! Pew, pew, pew!”

Micah: So, and then Harry’s broom goes into the Whomping Willow and that…

Andrew: Nooo!

Micah: …sets up the plot for the Firebolt…

Eric: The Nimbus…

Micah: …which comes up…

Eric: …2000…

Micah: …in later chapters.

Eric: …is destroyed.

Andrew: Nooo!

Eric: Is that the end of this chapter where they present it to him in the hospital…

Micah: Yes.

Eric: …wing?

Micah: In the hospital wing.

Eric: And it’s just a bunch of sticks.

Quote Quiz

Andrew: But now, here’s his chance to get the Firebolt! It’s newer and better! Yes, the Nimbus 2000 was filled with childhood memories, but who cares when there’s something bigger and better that awaits? So, that’s it for Chapter-by-Chapter. But first, Quote Quiz.

Ben: Quote quiz, quiz, quiz, quiz.

Andrew: Quote quiz, quiz, quiz.

“I doubt it will make much difference, unless a mad axe-man is waiting outside the doors to slaughter the first into the entrance hall.”

Eric: McGonagall.

Andrew: Yes! Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding!

Ben: And what does Eric win, Andrew?

Andrew: He wins a brand new microphone!

Ben: Ooh.

Jamie: Ooh.

Andrew: Just kidding, yours is fine. [laughs]

Jamie: Hey Andrew…

Ben: Awww.

Jamie: …I didn’t hear you do the thing. The introduction to that.

Andrew: I did! Quote quiz…

Jamie: Oh, yeah!

Andrew: …quiz, quiz, quiz.

Listener Tweet: Halloween

Andrew: Let’s get to some e-mails and tweets from this chapter. We asked people to send in their feedback about these chapters. They read them before listening to the show. They are very well-prepared listeners. Erica9918 says:

“Why is it that every Halloween something bad happens? In ‘Sorcerer’s Stone,’ the troll. In ‘CoS,’ Mrs. Norris gets petrified. And in ‘Prisoner of Azkaban,’ Black breaks in.”

I think we did a Halloween discussion on…

Eric: Oh! We did, we did…

Jamie: We talked about that…

Eric: Yeah.

Jamie: …didn’t we?

Andrew: Yeah.

Eric: We did when we were doing Chapter-by-Chapter last book.

Andrew: So tune into that episode…

Eric: Yep.

Andrew: …for the answer.

Eric: Chapter 12 significance, yep.

Listener Tweet: How Much Does Lucius Reveal?

Andrew: LuuJ writes:

“When Malfoy eggs on Harry about going and looking for Black, I find it interesting that it hints at how much Lucius really tells.”


Eric: Draco.

Andrew: Yeah, tells Draco, right.

Eric: Well, that was kind of my question too. What does Lucius know about Sirius Black’s allegiance?

Andrew: It’s a good question.

Lsitener Tweet: The Weasley’s Knowledge of Sirius

Ben: andreaenero writes:

“How did Malfoy know that Sirius had allegedly betrayed Harry’s parents, but Ron didn’t? They are both from wizarding families.”

I think Ron’s parents may…

Eric: Just kept it from him?

Ben: They have so many kids, they’re running like a mill, you know…

[Everyone laughs]

Ben: …what I mean? They’re running like a boot camp. They don’t have time to sit everyone down and…

Listener Tweet: Student’s Names

Andrew: Wikmans says:

“How does Lupin know their names before the first lesson? And why does he call them by first name when the other teachers don’t?”

Jamie: Because he’s different in that way, isn’t he?

Ben: Yeah.

[Eric laughs]

Ben: He wants to…

Andrew: He’s personable.

Ben: He wants to be personal…

Eric: No…

Ben: …you know?

Eric: …but he does. I noticed this too while reading. He does call Dean Thomas by his first name. And I don’t know – it made me think of whether or not he knew his dad or something because…

Jamie: No, no, it’s because he and James Potter switched places…

Eric: That’s…

Jamie: …when they were doing their thing.

Eric: …exactly what it is.

Ben: Awww.

[Jamie laughs]

Ben: Well, actually…

Eric: That…

Ben: Actually…

Eric: …theory was plausible, man.

Jamie: It was plausible, definitely.

Ben: I know. You were a big Galadriel water slash that theory supporter, Eric.

[Andrew laughs]

Ben: I remember that.

Eric: That was – it was a plausible theory at the time.

Ben: And I know some college professors who will get the students’ pictures before the class even begins and memorize their names.

Eric: That’s true.

Jamie: Aww, I bet that’s what they do.

[Eric laughs]

Jamie: I bet that’s what they do.

Make the Music Connection

Andrew: Yeah, Lupin has got nothing better to do. All right, now here’s a segment we haven’t done in a while: Make the Mu-mu-mu-mu-mu-mu-mu-mu-mu-mu-mu-mu-mu-mu-mu-music Connection! Yeah! Who wants to go first?

Jamie: Is this your show personality coming through?

Andrew: Yes.

[Jamie laughs]

Ben: Me.

Jamie: I’ll go first.

Andrew: You want to – oh, I’m sorry, Jamie. Ben said, “First,” first.

Jamie: Oh. Yeah, but he is there. So, the lag…

Andrew: True.

Jamie: …will…

Andrew: True.

Jamie: I probably said it first, really.

Andrew: Okay, we’ll pick…

Jamie: No, no, no.

Andrew: …some of…

Jamie: Ben, you…

Andrew: …the top songs.

Jamie: …take it.

Andrew: No, no, Jamie. You can.

Jamie: All right.

Andrew: We’ll pick some of the top hot songs right now. Jamie, are you a fan of Kesha?

Jamie: No.

Andrew: All right.

Jamie: I don’t know who it is.

Andrew: Well, try…

Ben: [singing] “Wake up in the morning…”

Andrew: No, not that song.

Ben: “…feeling like…”

Andrew: Here, try this.

Ben: “…P. Diddy.”

[“Blah Blah Blah” by Kesha (feat. 3OH!3) plays]

Andrew: Hold on.

[Song continues]

Jamie: Oh, this is terrible.

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: Hold on, just wait for the chorus.

[Song continues]

Andrew: “Blah Blah Blah” by Kesha. Just go off the song title. Blah blah blah.

[Song finishes]

Jamie: Blah blah blah? All right. Blah blah blah. Well, I think in Harry Potter, quite a few of people have that attitude. They just, “Blah blah blah, I’ve got magic. I don’t have to worry about anything because when push comes to shove, I can just cast a spell.” However, the other side has magic as well, which I think is a point made by Rufus Scrimgeour to the Muggle Prime Minister.

Andrew: Mhm.

Jamie: So yeah, I think that is the connection. The blah blah blah attitude throughout Harry Potter.

Andrew: Nice.

Jamie: Yeah. Sorry, I can’t think of anything else.

Andrew: No, I was going to make a Trelawney connection…

Jamie: I don’t know.

Andrew: …because she’s all…

Jamie: Yeah.

Andrew: …blah blah blah with all these dumb theories and stuff.

Jamie: Awww, yeah, yeah! That would have been a good one.

[Andrew laughs]

Jamie: Awww!

Andrew: That’s all right, that’s all right. All right, Ben. It’s your turn.

[“Escape Me” by Tiesto plays]

Andrew: [laughs] This is “Escape Me” by Tiesto.

[Song continues]

Andrew: Make the connection, Ben.

[Song continues]

Andrew: Ben?

Ben: Okay, Neville. Failure is Neville’s favorite thing.

Andrew: Oh.

Ben: Because he continually fails.

Andrew: Yeah.

Ben: But if you actually wait until the chorus, where he’s singing, Escape Me.

Andrew: Yeah.

Ben: Where she’s singing, Escape Me. I would say that that’s really Harry trying to break out, you know?

Andrew: Right.

Ben: Becoming all he wants. Or maybe it’s Dumbledore when he was a kid.

[Jamie laughs]

Ben: And that hidden side of him that was in love with Grindelwald.

Andrew: Mmm, good one.

Ben: Mmm.

Andrew: All right. Eric, here is your song.

[“Today Was A Fairytale” by Taylor Swift plays]

Andrew: “Today Was A Fairytale” by Taylor Swift.

Eric: Oh wow.

[Song continues]

Andrew: “Magic.” She said, “Magic.”

Jamie: Awww, yeah.

[Andrew laughs]

Jamie: What more do you need?

Ben: This is Ginny. This is so Ginny…

Eric: Yeah. This is Harry…

Ben: …being in love…

Eric: Hey…

Ben: …with Harry.

Eric: …hey, hey, who’s make the music connection…

[Andrew laughs]

Eric: …is this?

Ben: Well, I’m sorry. You’re just disconnected over there.

[Andrew laughs]

Eric: Yeah…

Andrew: Go ahead…

Eric: …it’s true.

Andrew: …Eric.

Eric: Yeah, this is how Harry is feeling when he has that one brief moment at the lake with Ginny in Book 6. Or he actually – it doesn’t even happen in the books. He references them later, like, “I’ve been having nice walks along the lake with you.” But that’s what happens in “6” where he’s – there is this brief downtime. He is actually with the girl he fancies and they have some good times before he does the Spider-Man thing.

Andrew: Good point. All right, and Micah, you’re the last one for today. Here we go!

[“Telephone” by Lady Gaga (feat. Beyonce) plays]

Andrew: “Telephone” by Lady Gaga and Beyonce.

[Song continues]

Andrew: “Stop calling, stop calling. I don’t want to pick up anymore.”

Ben: Ooh…

Andrew: How can you…

Ben: …I got one.

Andrew: …connect that?

Ben: I got one.

Micah: You got one, Ben, huh?

Andrew: Go ahead, Ben.

Ben: It’s Uncle Vernon.

[Andrew laughs]

Ben: It’s, like…

Jamie: Oh, yeah.

Ben: “Stop calling!”

[Everyone laughs]

Ben: He yells at Ron.

Andrew: I love it, I love it. You could also…

Micah: That was good, Ben.

Andrew: You could also…

Jamie: That’s…

Andrew: …connect that one…

Jamie: …perfect, yeah.

Andrew: …with all the owls coming into the home. [laughs] “Stop owling! Stop owling!” Oh no…

[Eric laughs]

Andrew: …it’s another song parody. [laughs] “I don’t want to pick up!”

Ben: [as Dumbledore] “Rah rah!”

[Andrew laughs]

Ben: [as Dumbledore] “Ooh la la.” [singing as himself] “Want your bad romance.”

Announcement: Podcast Alley and Infinitus 2010

Andrew: Okay. So before we wrap up the show today, just a couple of announcements for you all. That was a fun segment by the way. Don’t forget to vote for us on Podcast Alley. It’s now March. It’s MuggleCast March, the one month that makes sense when you say, “MuggleCast March.”

Ben: What about MuggleCast May?

Andrew: What? Oh, that’s true. Good point, thank you.

[Micah laughs]

Andrew: [laughs] Forgot about my birthday month.

Ben: Oh, oh, your birthday month? Yes, that’s what May is all about.

[Andrew laughs]

Micah: Shameless plug.

Andrew: So, and also…

Ben: Obama has declared May, ‘National Andrew Sims Month’.

Andrew: And also coming up this July 15th to…

Ben: Are we doing a podcast there, Andrew?

Andrew: Yes, yes, we are doing a podcast there! And more details about that will be announced soon. But it’s going to be in Orlando, Florida at Universal Studios Orlando, the resort. Universal announced…

Jamie: Ooh, that is exciting.

Andrew: Universal announced a party in the park.

Ben: Ooh.

Andrew: The Harry Potter theme park is going to be shutting…

Ben: Ooh!

Andrew: …down and only attendees…

Ben: Ooh!

Andrew: …of Infinitus are going to be able to attend.

Ben: Ooh!

Andrew: And they got a lot of cool stuff planned for that.

Ben: Jamie, will you be attending Infinitus? I know fans are dying to know.

Jamie: When is it? July?

Andrew: July 15th to the 18th in Orlando.

Jamie: Oh, I doubt I’ll be going. I’m a working…

Ben: Oh!

Jamie: …man.

Andrew: If you start…

Jamie: I can’t just…

Andrew: …swimming now…

Jamie: …take a…

Andrew: …you can make it.

Jamie: …holiday off.

Ben: [laughs] Ladies and gentlemen, Jamie is looking for sponsors for his swim to Infinitus.

[Everyone laughs]

Jamie: Yeah.

Ben: A mile.

Jamie: Someone has got to…

Ben: For donations…

Jamie: …give me however much…

Ben: …per mile.

Jamie: …money a mile.

Eric: For swimming?

Andrew: I’ll give you a penny a mile.

Jamie: You can afford more than that. Come on, guys.

[Andrew laughs]

Jamie: You get to live in California. You can move somewhere else.

Andrew: We’ll have to figure it out for next…

Ben: [laughs] I just have…

Andrew: …episode.

Ben: …this vision of Jamie back floating…

[Andrew and Jamie laugh]

Ben: …in the middle of the Atlantic. Just, like, [as Jamie] “Oh, I’m so tired.”

[Andrew laughs]

Ben: [as Jamie] “I can’t!”

Andrew: [as Jamie] “Get me off!”

Ben: [as Jamie] “Just five more minutes, and…”

[Everyone laughs]

Jamie: Ben, you couldn’t have pure relaxation in the middle of the ocean.

[Andrew laughs]

Ben: Oh no, you definitely couldn’t.

Andrew: So visit and if you register to attend, please put “MuggleNet” or “MuggleCast” in the referral box so they know who sent you. Finally today, don’t forget to visit It’s got everything you need pertaining to this show. Also, follow us on Twitter at

Ben: Benschoen.

[Andrew laughs]

Announcement: 10,000 Twitter Followers

Andrew: And as well. Through our Twitter and Facebooks, we update you with the latest information regarding new episodes, what we are doing around the site, the podcast. Also, I have an exciting announcement. MuggleCast just surpassed 10,000 followers on Twitter.

Jamie: Yeah!

Ben: What does this mean, Andrew?

[Show music begins]

Andrew: Well, we like to use the Twitter account a lot to let everybody know what’s going on with the show, and we hope you enjoy those updates. And our Facebook fan page has 9,779 fans, so become a fan on Facebook and Twitter:, to get all the information.

Ben: Please.

Jamie’s Plea: The Chagos Conservation Trust

Jamie: I have one thing to say quickly. This is an environmental plea, okay? Now, this one is the Chagos protected area, which is somewhere in the ocean. I’m not sure exactly where. However, as I’m sure all of you guys know that how ever many thousands of millions of fish are dying and stuff like that. And the British government has a chance to create the world’s largest conservation area in the ocean. And people have two days until Friday to register their support for it. So please everybody, you don’t have to live in Britain. Please can you go to That’s with a hyphen in between, and it’s C-H-A-G-O-S. And you guys can do it too.

Andrew: I will!

Jamie: And go there and register your support. And you can write to the foreign secretary and tell them to do it. Please do it. It’s going to take two minutes. Please everyone do that because it is important. It’s some of the cleanest waters on Earth and it’s going to go if people don’t protect it. So please, please go and do it. And I’ll post a link on my Twitter. That is So, I’ll put it on there.

Show Close

Andrew: Thanks everyone for listening. It’s been another fun show. We’ll see you all next time for Episode 193. I’m Andrew Sims.

Ben: I’m…

Micah: Four.

Ben: …Ben Schoen.

Andrew: 194, sorry.

Eric: I am Eric Scull.

Jamie: I’m Jamie Lawrence.

Micah: And I’m Micah Tannenbaum.

Andrew: We’ll see you next time for Episode 194!

Ben: See you folks!

Andrew: Bye-bye, bye-bye, bye-bye!

Jamie and Micah: Bye!

[Show music continues]

Blooper: I’m Ben Scone

Ben: I’m Ben…

Eric: I’m Eric…

Ben: …Scho-en.

Eric: …Scull.

Jamie: Ooh!

Eric: Scone? Sorry, Ben. While you were gone, I kind of usurped the title of…

Ben: Oh.

Eric: …the second order.

Ben: Oh.

Andrew: Ooh.

Ben: Oh.

Andrew: Go ahead…

Ben: You jerk!

Andrew: …Jamie.

Eric: You do that again.

Jamie: Ooh.

Ben: I made you. I made you, Eric.

Jamie: Technically, Eric made you, didn’t he?

Ben: [laughs] No, Eric didn’t make me!

Eric: No, I made Jamie, though.

Jamie: Yeah, yeah! Eric made me!

Eric: Before the…

Jamie: Eric made me, yeah.

Eric: It’s cool.

Andrew: You’re all Eric and thinking you made each other.

[Ben and Eric laugh]

Ben: What Andrew made all of us.

[Everyone laughs]

Jamie: Andrew made…

Blooper: Would You Like Some Thigh Food?

Jamie: Hey, hey, Andrew, Andrew, what type of food is T-H-A-I food?

Andrew: Thai. [laughs]

[Jamie laughs]

Andrew: I learnt my lesson about that one a while ago.

Ben: [laughs] What were you calling it?

Andrew: Back in 2006, we were all in the car in L.A. somewhere. And we drove by a Thai place, and I said, “Oh, thigh,” or something.

[Jamie laughs]

Ben: Ha!

Jamie: He said, “Oh, we should go and have some thigh food.”

Andrew: I had never heard the word before! I didn’t know.

Ben: Some thigh food. That sounds kind of gross.

Andrew: All right.

Jamie: [laughs] Yeah!

Andrew: Go ahead, Micah.