MuggleCast 214 Transcript
[Intro music begins]
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[“Hedwig’s Theme” plays]
David Heyman: Hello, this is David Heyman and I’m the producer of the Harry Potter films, and this is MuggleCast.
[Show music begins]
Micah: Because we’re about to only scratch the surface, this is MuggleCast Episode 214 for November 20th, 2010.
[Show music continues]
Andrew: Welcome to MuggleCast Episode 214, and oh my goodness, is this a big show! Not only are we talking about the penultimate film in the Harry Potter series, but we are also welcoming MuggleNet’s – I like to call him a god, I don’t think that’s too high of a praise. Richard Reid is joining us this week on the show. Hello Richard!
Richard: Hello everyone.
Andrew: Richard is Scottish and he stepped in when MuggleNet was on its knees about a year ago when the site was down for a week, and ever since then he has been a MuggleNet god. So, it’s great to have you on, Richard.
Richard: It’s great to be here.
Andrew: Yes. And our peasants, Eric and Micah, are here too, so hello peasants.
Eric: I like to think of Micah and I more as serfs, really, living off the fat of the land.
Eric: That’s just me.
Andrew: Well, we have lots to get to this week, so we will worry about classifying our ranks in the MuggleNet kingdom at a later date. I’m Andrew Sims.
Eric: I’m Eric Scull.
Micah: I’m Micah Tannenbaum.
Richard: And I’m Richard Reid.
[Show music continues]
Andrew: Micah Tannenbaum, what’s going on in the news this week? Besides the elephant in the room.
Andrew: And I’m not talking about Eric.
Eric: Although I do make a nice elephant.
Micah: There was a movie that was released earlier this week, in case you didn’t know, Andrew.
Andrew: Right. But other than that… [laughs]
Micah: Other than that, what’s going on? I don’t know, not too much. How have you been? How are things going?
Andrew: Oh my goodness, you’re failing as a news anchor.
Micah: Oh. Well, you knew that a hundred episodes ago.
News: Deathly Hallows: Part 1 U.K. and U.S. Premieres
Micah: But let’s start with the premieres for Deathly Hallows and Richard, Andrew, you guys were in London, let’s start there.
Andrew: Yeah, so I didn’t go to the premiere but Richard did along with Nick, who’s been on the show a few times. And you guys filmed the interviews and you said it was a blast, right Richard?
Richard: Yeah, it was absolutely crazy. I mean, if you can imagine four or five thousand fans screaming all afternoon. The place was surrounded by fireworks and everything, so it was so cool. We got to meet everyone, all the cast came round to us. Warner Bros. was really great by bringing all the cast particularly to the fan site section. Other than that, the cast and the crew basically decided where they wanted to go, and of course, J.K. Rowling came especially over to talk to us so that was…
Andrew: That’s very cool.
Andrew: Yeah. And who else did you get to talk to in particular? Any stand-out interviews?
Richard: Actually, the most interesting interview we had was the person who played Runcorn because…
Richard: …this was his first time in the films and it turned out he was a major Harry Potter fan, he had read all the books so many times.
Richard: And he was talking about stuff that wasn’t even part of this film but in previous books so that was really cool. He was actually the first one on the red carpet, I guess not many people really knew who he was.
Andrew: [laughs] He couldn’t wait to get out there and talk.
Richard: [laughs] Exactly, this is finally…
Richard: He’s got his shining moment in the press. The producer, David Heyman – we had a really good chat with him. We didn’t really get to speak to Dan and Emma that much because the time they got to us was the very end, and they were all being rushed right through.
Andrew: They’re always being rushed in.
Richard: Yeah, so that kind of sucks.
Andrew: They’re always being rushed in, which is the same thing that we had in New York where we talked to a few of the crew members, David Barron, David Yates, and Stuart – sorry, not Stuart Craig…
Micah: Steve Kloves.
Andrew: Steve Kloves. And those interviews will be on MuggleNet soon. We have – we got a lot of cool information out of them, particularly Steve Kloves, the screenwriter. He’s written all of them except for Order of the Phoenix and he said that – I said to him, “David Heyman has said that you have jokingly said you could turn the seventh book into three films.” And he’s, like – and he looks at me deadpan and he is, like, “Oh, yeah.” I was, like, “You could?” [laughs] And he was, like, “Yeah, absolutely.”
Andrew: [laughs] And then he goes into this rant about how it would be so easy to do. And of course they’re not going to turn it into three films but I found it interesting that he thought it would be so easy to turn it into three, so maybe you missed the opportunity by Warner Bros. I don’t know.
Micah: No, I think two is enough and…
Andrew: [laughs] Yeah, me too.
Micah: But let’s talk a little bit about the New York premiere in comparison to London because I feel as if a lot of fans wrote in – a lot of fans had comments about how the premiere was set up, and even Andrew, you and I. You mentioned how the trio were sort of rushed through at the end. Ralph Fiennes didn’t come over. We didn’t really get a chance to talk to David Heyman at all, I don’t even know if – that he walked the red carpet for that event. And it was a little bit disappointing, I think, especially in comparison to the coverage that we had for Half-Blood Prince and Order of the Phoenix.
Micah: And then even – I remember going to the premiere in New York City for Goblet of Fire, that’s when we all met each other for the first time, and this was nowhere close.
Andrew: Yeah, there were a couple of problems. For one, the fans were upset because the stars didn’t meet the fans, the fans who had been waiting there all day to see them. And then the red carpet interview area was sort of housed in a tent so the fans couldn’t even see the stars being interviewed like they could at past premieres or like you could at the world premiere in London that Richard went to. And we got this one e-mail from Sara, 19, of New York, New York who went to the premiere, and she writes:
“My name is Sara and I’ve been listening to the show for a while, but I’ve never felt the need to write in until now. I live in New York and went to the ‘Deathly Hallows’ premiere tonight. I got there at about 8:30 AM, got a nice spot right by the barricade and made some friends. The whole day was very exciting with everyone waiting for the stars, talking about ‘Harry Potter’, cheering whenever a bus with a ‘Deathly Hallows’ ad on it drove by. As it got closer to 6:00 PM…”
Which is when the stars would arrive.
“…we kept wondering when they were going to shut down the street so the actors could walk by the barricades. Except that they never did, and as a result, the actors weren’t allowed to walk by the fans for their safety. Most of the people around me got there at 8:00 AM or earlier, some camped out overnight, and some drove 14 hours just for the premiere, just to see the stars and get something signed. But we got nothing. I had never been to a movie premiere before, but I’ve seen previous Harry Potter premieres, more specifically, the most recent London premiere, which looked amazing and it seemed like there was a lot of fan interaction. The most we got in New York was Ralph Fiennes rolling down his window and waving at us, which sparked a ‘Voldemort’ chant through the crowd, and Tom Felton who actually crossed the street and starting signing autographs before security whisked him away. Overall, it was just a very big disappointment. I spent 12 hours sitting on the sidewalk for absolutely nothing. From what I’ve seen, I feel like this was the worst of the Harry Potter premieres, the most unorganized. Why? Was it just from poor planning?”
She said it was a great weekend because of the Quidditch World Cup and all that, and she looks forward to hearing our review. So yeah, and then we sort of – we went out to film the fans waiting outside, they’re all excited, we like to get footage of that. And I’m filming for, like, a minute and this security guy comes up to me, and he’s, like, “Are you press?” I’m, like, “Yeah.” And he’s, like, “We need you to stay in the tent and stay there.” I’m, like, “What? What is this?” I mean, [laughs] when did…
Andrew: Urgh! It was nuts.
Micah: It was disappointing.
Andrew: And it was all because they wouldn’t close down the street and my theory is they could have closed down the street if they wanted to. I think they chose not to.
Eric: Well, that’s it, isn’t it? I mean, why didn’t they make that choice?
Andrew: Because the stars – I hate to say it, the stars didn’t want to go meet the fans? I don’t know.
Andrew: That’s the only thing I could think of.
Micah: Well, clearly that’s not true though. You look – Tom Felton went over there to sign some autographs.
Micah: I think…
Eric: He braved his own life by doing that, crossing the street.
Micah: Well, I don’t know about that.
Andrew: [laughs] He braved his own life!
Micah: The cars were going pretty slow. I think that it could have been that the cast that they had for this particular film on the red carpet was so small that maybe they didn’t think it was necessary to close down the street. You’re only talking about a handful of actors from the films that were there.
Eric: As opposed to the London premiere? Or…
Micah: As opposed to even Half-Blood Prince, from last year. I mean, you had the trio, Tom Felton, Ralph Fiennes, and that was it.
Andrew: Last year we had Alan Rickman…
Eric: Well, this was a different venue than before, wasn’t it? Or not?
Andrew: It was a different venue, that’s the other thing. This is the first time a New York premiere wasn’t held at the Ziegfeld Theater.
Eric: I thought so.
Andrew: So, we don’t want to dwell on it but it was a little bit of a disappointment. I don’t know.
Eric: I noticed a sheer drop in our coverage too. I mean, the London premiere…
Eric: No, on MuggleNet there were updates, a live stream, all sorts of stuff coming out of London, and New York, it was the next day, it was nothing.
Andrew: Yeah, I know. It was hard, it was hard, it was hard. But okay, so what else is going on in the news, Micah? Other than that.
News: Deathly Hallows: Part 2 Epilogue Reshoot
Micah: You were over in London and there was a press junket that took place.
Micah: And some of the information that came out of this press junket – one of the biggest pieces of information is that they are going to be reshooting parts of the Deathly Hallows epilogue, and you got a chance to talk to, I think it was David Yates, about it?
Andrew: Yeah. Well, I didn’t get to, but then at another table – by the way, the press…
Micah: No, you asked him at the New York premiere.
Andrew: Oh, right. Yeah…
Andrew: …at the New York premiere I did. [laughs]
Eric: Well, the New York premiere…
Andrew: No, but…
Eric: …was so low-key it didn’t even happen, really.
Micah: I can’t remember if it was…
Andrew: [laughs] No, I know.
Micah: Was it Yates…
Andrew: I rate it…
Micah: …or was it David Barron? I can’t remember who you asked.
Andrew: No, I asked Yates.
Andrew: I asked Yates. But yeah, so this piece of info originally came out at the junkets which, by the way, went very well. That was very well-organized and we got a lot of time to talk to everyone, and I wrote up a report which is on MuggleNet now about that. But anyway, so they are going to be reshooting some of the epilogue scenes and David Yates, Radcliffe, Watson and Grint all confirmed this. Basically the studio looked at it and they want it – basically what Yates said to me was that they needed to draw it out a little more and not in a bad way but so people can appreciate the moment more, can really get in the scene. It can’t feel rushed, it has to feel just right because this is the final scene of the series. So, they’re going back to do some reshoots. They’re not going to King’s Cross…
Andrew: …they’re going to be doing these at the studio. They originally shot the epilogue at King’s Cross so I’m sure they’re going to mix the scenes together. So, it’s a bit of a surprise but it’s good that they’re doing that because I think everyone’s worst fear would be this scene being screwed up…
Andrew: …being rushed or not feeling long enough.
News: Fourth Annual Quidditch World Cup
Micah: I agree, yeah. And last bit of news – you mentioned it earlier, but let’s talk for a few minutes here about the Quidditch World Cup that took place over the premiere weekend and Andrew, you and I and Richard got a chance to go check it out firsthand. And I have to say, I was pretty impressed, I thought it was kind of cool. And a lot of different colleges and universities were there, I didn’t realize how big of a sport this has become. And people had, literally, fans that were there, I guess classmates from their school that came to cheer them on, and overall it was a pretty impressive event to watch.
Andrew: Yeah. So, for anyone who doesn’t know, the Quidditch World Cup – we talked about it on Episode 213 and we said we were going to go, and Micah and I were going to have a picnic. And we didn’t have a picnic but we did have a fun time watching and Richard was there, too. And yeah, it was just a lot of fun. I mean, it’s really – it was more exciting than I thought it would be and it got very violent at some points, these people are tossing balls at each other and knocking each other out. A few people had to be sent to the hospital because they were – I don’t know what exactly, what injuries…
Andrew: …they received but [laughs] there was blood being shed.
Andrew: It’s a brutal – it’s a surprisingly brutal sport [laughs] so it was a lot of fun to watch. And presumably it’s going to be in New York again next year and anyone who can make it there should definitely go. We saw a lot of MuggleNet and MuggleCast fans there too, so shout-out to them who all went. They all had the right idea by going. Richard, do you have any other thoughts about it? I know you were enjoying it, too.
Richard: Oh, I loved it. I wrote up a review as well, so if anyone wants to…
Andrew: Oh, right.
Richard: …find more information about it then they can check that out. But I thought the highlight of the entire thing was the commentators because in true Lee Jordan style, they were hilarious throughout the entire process.
Richard: Occasionally they reported on the matches but mostly they were going off on random tangents about Death Star trash compactors and…
Richard: …epic Nicolas Cage movies and… [laughs]
Andrew: Yeah, they were improv students at Middlebury College which is the college that started this whole Quidditch World Cup thing.
Micah: And won this year.
Richard: And won.
Andrew: And won again. They have won every cup. [laughs]
Eric: Man, that’s like Gryffindor, man.
Andrew: I know.
Micah: And how about the Snitches, though? I thought that – the things that they did were pretty creative.
Richard: [laughs] Yeah.
Eric: So, how did they do the Snitch?
Andrew: The Snitch was the best part. It would be one person – sometimes a guy, sometimes a girl – dressed in all yellow and she would have a – he or she would have a ball hanging from their waistband, bouncing on their butt, basically, because when they’re running…
Andrew: …it’s bouncing off their butt. And then – so they will come out onto the field and they will start running around. And there’s a couple of rules in place so if a Seeker gets hit by – I guess it was a Bludger or a Quaffle, they have to go back and tag their end of the field…
Andrew: …before chasing the Snitch again. And then the Snitch could run around anywhere, it didn’t just have to be the field, so they were running outside of the park…
Andrew: …they were hiding in tents, they were wearing referee costumes pretending to not be the Snitch…
Andrew: …a bunch of clever stuff like that. It was cool.
Eric: That’s hilarious.
Andrew: Yeah, that was the best – the funnest part. And the Snitch was only worth thirty points so that way it wasn’t an automatic win.
Andrew: But it did end the game.
Micah: Yeah, I thought they did a really good job. It’s kind of a creative game where they let the Snitch go wherever he or she wants to go at the beginning of the match. And everybody has to keep their eyes closed, I guess it’s kind of an honor system, that you don’t take a peek as to where the Snitch goes. But I think there is so much going on on the pitch that it would be hard for the Seekers to – or not the Seekers. What do you call the people that go after the Snitch?
Eric: Yeah, the Seekers.
Richard: The Seekers.
Andrew: The Seekers.
Micah: The Seekers. Sorry, yeah.
Andrew: [laughs] What did you say? The Sneakers? Like the Nike shoe?
Micah: No, no, I said, “Seekers,” but I thought I had it wrong.
Micah: No, I think it would even be hard for them to find this person, especially with four other matches going on or whatever it was, so I don’t know. I had a good time, I thought it was well done.
Andrew: I did too, yeah.
Richard: Even if they did find the Snitch, each Snitch could really take care of themselves.
Richard: They were all…
Micah: Especially that one girl.
Richard: …pushing and punching people away from them.
Micah: I want her name.
Andrew: There was this one girl who was…
Micah: Yeah, she was awesome.
Andrew: …the Seeker – or was the Snitch and then on one of the teams, the Seeker was this big guy. And I was, like, oh man, this is not fairly matched. I mean, this big guy is going to take this little girl down quick.
Andrew: But she was standing on her own, she was doing good, fighting him off and stuff. [laughs]
Richard: She was slapping him on the back of the head and running away! [laughs]
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Overall Thoughts
Andrew: Yeah, it was excellent. So, that’s the Quidditch World Cup. We’ll report – we’ll definitely let everyone know when the next one is. Presumably it will be in November 2011 and we hope everyone who can get there can go because it’s really worth checking out and we’ll try to get there next year as well. So, now let’s get to the big story, the main event, the bread and butter.
Micah: And what would that be?
Andrew: That would be the countdown to Part 2.
Micah: There you go.
Andrew: [laughs] No, the movie, let’s talk about the movie. So much to talk about, too. We should actually give some box office numbers to start. As of Friday, it brought in $61 million for the opening day and that puts it on track to break a franchise record which is highest opening weekend of all time for a Harry Potter film. So, the previous record was set by Goblet of Fire, actually, which brought in $102.7 million and experts believe that [laughs] this film, Part 1, will break that record. So, very cool to hear, very exciting to hear. And let’s talk about the film now. Let’s get – we’ll start with overall thoughts, then we’re going to break it down scene-by-scene. And then we’re going to go into favorite new character, least favorite scene, talk about the split and get some listener thoughts as well, so we have a lot to get to. Eric, let’s start with you. You, of course, saw it at a very, very, very early screening in Chicago, practically last year at this point, and the special effects weren’t complete. So, now – and the music wasn’t either. So, now that you’ve seen it complete, has your thoughts on it changed at all? Better? Worse? What do you think?
Eric: I loved it even more this time than I did the first time and many people may not think that is possible, but it is. I loved it, I absolutely loved the movie. I think it’s my favorite movie, I think it’s – I would even go so far as to say it’s very close to perfect, in my opinion.
Andrew: Were there any big changes that you saw that – between the screener copy, the screening that you went to a few months ago and this one?
Eric: There were …
Andrew: Like any scenes added or removed?
Eric: Yeah, there were six that I counted that were either just different shots – none of them are huge, but there were six different kind of changes and I mean, I don’t want to talk about them all here but I will talk about them later on in the show.
Eric: But yeah, I thought that this movie just blew the others away, especially with the completed soundtrack. I hadn’t heard it at all the first time and it fits so well with the film just as you’re going through. And I mean, I listened to the soundtrack the night before too, so I just had it on my mind. But it seemed to match everything in the film, it didn’t disappoint. We were worried – we talked on MuggleCast about the soundtrack possibly being less or different from what fans expected but I thought it was perfect, and I just – I loved it.
Andrew: Richard, your overall thoughts, please.
Richard: Well, I think mine is pretty much the opposite of Eric’s because I came out of the cinema feeling pretty disappointed, to be honest.
Richard: I didn’t think that much of the film. I thought – I don’t want to go into too much detail at this point but I thought the first third of the movie – the first thirty minutes was brilliant. That was some of my favorite scenes from any Harry Potter movie. And from then onwards I thought it deteriorated. It was dragging, it became dull and I thought the ending was quite anti-climatic, so – I don’t know. Overall – I mean, I’m not that impressed with it.
Andrew: Micah, similar thoughts to Eric or Richard?
Micah: I’m going to go somewhere in between. I think when I left the theater, I felt as though something was missing and I’ll go into that a little bit more, I guess, as we talk about different scenes and plot points, and things like that. I thought the book-to-film adaptation was great and I think it’s probably the closest to anything we’ve seen since the first two films, and Steve Kloves did a great job. I think overall it’s a good movie but I have some issues with it. I’ll leave it at that.
Andrew: I think I would have to side with Micah, I agree. I enjoyed it a lot and I’ll get into some specific favorite scenes in a bit, but overall – I was shocked at first and I was a bit worried that fans were going to have the same reaction that I did but I was proven wrong. I mean, most fans it seems like really, really loved it and really thought it was going to be – or everyone thought it was the best. So, obviously we have a lot of opposing thoughts which is good…
Micah: Which is good, yeah.
Andrew: …so we can…
Eric: It’s going to be a good show.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Opening Montage
Andrew: [laughs] Yeah, so we’re not all going to be, like, “Yeah, yeah, yeah!” So, let’s go first to major scenes and we’re going to go in order to try to keep this as orderly as possible. [laughs] We’ll start with the opening montage, at least I’ve been calling it the montage because we see a variety of scenes sort of all mashed together. It’s not a montage like what we’ve seen in Order of the Phoenix and Half-Blood Prince, which I didn’t like. But the opening montage with the Minister making a speech, Hermione Obliviating her parents’ minds, the Dursleys leaving, shots of Ron at the Burrow, all those. That opening montage got me really excited for what I was about to watch. Did anyone else have that sort of feeling?
Micah: I thought those opening few minutes were great and it was really impactful the way that Hermione went about Obliviating her parents’ minds.
Micah: And I think people who maybe didn’t get the severity of what was going on in this film got it right off the bat…
Micah: …with what she had to go through. And with the Dursleys though, I really felt that – and I put this in the review that I wrote – possibly one of the most redeeming moments in the whole series was questionably omitted here, specifically when Dudley asked why Harry isn’t coming with him. That was in the book but in the movie all Dudley asks is why they have to leave. And I’m worried about how they’re going to tie in Petunia to the next film, even though I know David Yates mentioned when we spoke to him on the red carpet that that scene is a deleted scene on the DVD. So, why they didn’t include it? I was a little bit upset about that…
Eric: Sorry, what scene?
Micah: …because I thought it really redeemed – a scene between Harry and Petunia. But I feel that leaving that scene out, it was a redeeming moment for Dudley and I think a lot of people were actually looking forward to that.
Andrew: Maybe they took it out because his character really wasn’t developed…
Eric: Yeah, I think…
Andrew: …in the past few films.
Eric: Exactly. I think people have to remember that the Dursleys – the role of the Dursleys is quite diminished in the films, especially as of late. In the first three films I would say they were probably given due credit, but lately it’s been reduced. I mean, I think the most – especially with Dudley, it’s been Movie 5 when he obviously gets attacked by the Dementor. But I don’t know that it would have had the same effect that Petunia and Harry are talking. Meanwhile the rest of the world is in – a lot of people are going through a lot of horrible things. I don’t know that it would have meant anything to the audience, especially those unfamiliar with the books.
Andrew: One thing that Emma brought up at the junket in London about that scene with Hermione Obliviating her parents’ mind is she said she could really connect to that, and she said – she was like, “I don’t want to get very emotional but my parents separated, and so I could really connect with that, having to split the family into two.” I was, like, “Oh wow, she had something really to relate to for this very small scene.”
Andrew: But it was very – it really struck a chord with her.
Eric: So powerful, too.
Eric: And just – I know we will be saying this a lot but I mean, Emma Watson, man, she was awesome in this movie.
Richard: She was. I thought her acting…
Richard: …was the best I’ve seen in any of the Harry Potter films, and she kind of stole the show a bit. And you always saw in every scene how much emotion she was pouring out, and particularly in the Obliviating scene.
Andrew: And another fun fact about that scene was those baby pictures of her were her actual…
Andrew: …baby pictures. [laughs]
Eric: I was trying to think – are those the same parents they had in Chamber of Secrets?
Andrew: Well, not the same…
Eric: The same actors?
Andrew: Those weren’t her real – oh, I don’t know. But the shots of Emma in those photos were her actual child photos, not – the parents were obviously…
Andrew: …replaced for the film.
Eric: I thought it was fitting because she is removed from those photos. So, the fact that they had to place her in those photos is kind of funny, it’s kind of easy to create that effect…
Eric: …if she hadn’t really been in those photos to begin with. Just before we move on, there was a small change in Dursleys departing. There wasn’t the scene with Harry and Petunia, I didn’t see that and I’m interested. But actually what Dudley says to Vernon, I guess in the film, is, “Why are we leaving?” And Vernon says, “Because it’s not safe.”
Eric: Is that – yeah. Originally at the pre-screening, there was another shot of Vernon and Dudley learning – sorry, loading the car and Dudley asked him – Dudley asked Vernon, “Why isn’t Harry coming with us?” or “Why isn’t he coming with us?” And Vernon says to him, “Because he doesn’t want to.” And it’s not the kind of scene – it’s not like he’s telling Dudley that Harry is being a jerk. He’s saying very matter-of-factly he doesn’t want to diffuse the emotion. It’s this great…
Micah: So, you’re saying that that was cut out…
Eric: That was cut out.
Micah: …of the final film?
Eric: And in fact replaced…
Micah: Yeah. And I don’t know why that…
Micah: See, I do think that could have been, as I said before, a redeeming scene for Dudley because despite what you said, he wasn’t as built up as much as a character, with the exception of Order of the Phoenix. I still think that when you look at that family as a whole and how they have treated Harry, to have their son turn around and say something like that…
Micah: I think it was something that people were looking forward to.
Eric: And I think maybe it was removed because people would think it would be confusing because obviously Vernon is saying Harry doesn’t want to. Maybe people would have taken that literally but what it really means is, what the line in the film is, it’s not safe. So, I guess that was just one of those – but that was the first change that I noticed.
Andrew: Another scene I really liked in this montage was when Harry opens the old cupboard under the stairs again. And I’m trying to page through the book right now to see if that is actually in here, but does anyone remember that actually being in the book…
Andrew: …where he sort of looks at that?
Richard: It’s in the book.
Andrew: And he – it is? Okay. And he picks up the old pieces from his…
Eric: The knights.
Andrew: The knights which he played with in Sorcerer’s Stone, right?
Eric: [laughs] Those…
Andrew: In the film. I thought that was awesome.
Eric: I’m surprised nobody made off with those. [laughs]
Andrew: [laughs] Yeah, that was really cool. I thought that was a really good throwback and that was one of the things I’ve been hoping to see in this film, just a lot of references to the older films, a lot of little tributes like that. That was definitely a nice little tribute that they did.
Eric: And that first shot from inside the cupboard, when he first opens the cupboard door, the camera is inside the cupboard and it just looks so much like that first teaser for Sorcerer’s Stone…
Eric: …years ago, in 2000, maybe it was? “There’s no such thing as magic,” and he…
Eric: …slams it shut. But it’s so reminiscent of that that it was painfully beautiful.
Andrew: Somebody should do a side-by-side shot of those two…
Eric: [laughs] Well, it will still be a vent in the cupboard when all is said and done.
[Andrew and Richard laugh]
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Seven Potters
Andrew: Next big scene: Seven Potters. We all know it well from the book. I had made it very clear this is one of the scenes that I was most looking forward to on past episodes of MuggleCast and I was pretty satisfied with it. The one thing that I thought – and I teased this on the last episode of MuggleCast, I said I didn’t want to spoil it for anyone too early. But I think that where the camera sort of does a pan around and you don’t see their true transformations, you just see their early transformations, I thought that was a bit cheap at first. But now, seeing it in the film, in the context of everything, I thought it was really well done and the audience in the fan theater that I went to just ate that up, with all of the different Harrys talking in different people’s voices.
Andrew: That was hilarious.
Eric: Yeah. Interestingly, they kept the continuity of, I guess, Chamber of Secrets, which is a departure from the book, that you don’t sound like the person you are changing into. Complete movie-ism, but it works so well again in this film because even later at the Ministry, you need to remember who is who. It’s just a lot easier. But it was interesting they kept that and that pan-around shot is why I liked the Seven Potters. It’s one of two pan-around shots in the film that were just so awesome and – I mean, the other one being later in the woods when Hermione’s protection is tested by the Snatchers. But I was just blown away by everything the camera is doing, even this early on. It was awesome.
Micah: Yeah, I agree. This scene was done very well. We got a pretty good sense of it beforehand because most of it was released online. But there were parts of it that I was surprised weren’t in that clip, that 90-second clip that we got and I thought it was one of the better scenes of the entire film.
Richard: I seem to remember the girls at my screening seem to enjoy when Harry was taking his shirt off.
Eric: And there was a bra underneath.
Andrew: And Harry in a bra was very funny as well. And by the way, we got our answer to the question of how they would introduce Bill Weasley and it was basically how I predicted. Micah, were you satisfied with that? I mean, basically Bill just says, “Hey, I’m Bill!” [laughs] And that’s it.
Micah: Yeah, and he mentions that he was attacked by Greyback.
Andrew: Right, which was said so quickly and so…
Micah: I don’t know if people picked it up.
Andrew: Yeah, I don’t think so either. And he had a thick accent, in my opinion, so [laughs] all I heard was, [mumbles] “Greyback.” [mumbles] [laughs]
Eric: And then Lupin makes the joke about steak which is in the books. But yeah, it’s kind of rushed.
Andrew: Yeah. So, at least we got that. And also Fleur was, like, “Oh, hey, hey! How are you?” And…
Eric: Oh, Tonks and Lupin are kind of pregnant.
Andrew: Yeah, that was really quick too! Because we don’t hear her say it, we just hear her…
Eric: Yeah, she gets cut off…
Eric: …by Moody.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Death Eaters at Malfoy Manor
Micah: Let’s talk about the scene at Malfoy Manor because we completely left that out.
Andrew: Oh yes, of course. Malfoy Manor, when Snape gives Voldemort what the plan is to move Harry. The Malfoy Manor scenes overall, each one of them was my absolute favorite because Ralph Fiennes was just fantastic, as was Alan Rickman, and Bellatrix was just incredible!
Andrew: I mean, she had this extra sense of craziness to her.
Eric: Well, not just craziness, but I want to say she was more rooted in reality. Sure, she’s serving this dark wizard, but she just seemed to be in the zone a little bit better than she has been. She’s not just crazy laughing for no reason. She was kind of seriously – she wanted to be the one to kill Harry.
Richard: She was…
Eric: And she asked permission and then she was denied permission, and she bowed her head, kind of sulky.
Micah: She looked like a beaten dog.
Micah: Or not a beaten dog. Like when you scold a dog and the dog puts its head down?
Micah: You know what I am talking about? That’s exactly what she looked like.
Andrew: Yeah, yeah. [laughs]
Richard: I just thought she came across as pure evil. I mean, there is no other word to describe it.
Eric: I wanted to talk about Lucius just quickly because…
Micah: Oh, yeah.
Eric: …Jason Isaacs in this film – he didn’t shave for a couple of days.
Eric: Lucius is kind of rough around the edges and [laughs] when Voldemort asked him for his wand, I think this is one of the standout scenes in the film, is when Voldemort takes Lucius’s wand, and snaps off the little…
Andrew: Yeah, yeah.
Eric: …extra bit and just throws it on the table, and it clunks and you could just hear it clunk. And the face Lucius makes, he’s just defeated.
Andrew: In my theater when he cracked it, everyone went, “Ooh.”
Andrew: [laughs] It was very creepy. I don’t know if this was in the book: did Voldemort steal Lucius’s razor, as well?
Andrew: I couldn’t figure out why he hadn’t shaved.
Eric: Yeah, yeah, I don’t know.
Micah: I think they really did a great job of showing how stressed out Lucius Malfoy has been…
Eric: The whole family.
Micah. Yeah, the whole family, really, over the course of, I guess, the couple of weeks since we last saw them in Half-Blood Prince. I mean, you could really see it in Jason Isaacs, just how embattled he was and everything.
Eric: A change is brewing.
Micah: The stress that he’s been under, yeah.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Dumbledore’s Will and Testament
Andrew: So, now let’s move on to The Will and Testament. This was, of course, right before the wedding, when Scrimgeour comes in. And this scene, I was pretty pleased with this because it turned out to be pretty funny because Ron is sort of just acting a bit dumb. He’s just, like, “Oh, cool.” [laughs] And Bill Nighy, he was just great, I thought.
Andrew: Anyone have any problems with this scene? Or…
Richard: I actually didn’t think – I didn’t really like his performance. I think I’m one of the only ones because…
Richard: Well, in the book, you get the impression that the Minister – he was an ex-Auror, he’s really rough. He kind of personifies a sort of power and bravery. I didn’t think he came across as that. I thought Bill Nighy’s accent was sort of middle England and he was kind of a bit afraid, he was a bit weak. I don’t know. I didn’t think he was that great.
Eric: It’s interesting because obviously in the book, he has a little bit more time to try and persuade Harry. I think even in the movie he tries to persuade – he says something like, “You can’t fight this on your own.” And it’s almost like he is extending an invitation to cooperate, to work with Harry. But it’s not developed and if they – obviously he’s dead in the next – in the very, very next scene, it’s the wedding and we find out that he’s just been killed…
Eric: …mere hours after visiting Harry, so I guess maybe that was a choice so that they couldn’t – I mean, if they had made him more – stronger, they would have had to develop sort of why he was able to die. We’re just able to believe that he was overpowered and that’s just how things were, without asking too much about it.
Micah: And can I bring up a larger point here? Because I think it’s kind of the bigger problem that I had with this film and it relates to Scrimgeour. One of the biggest disconnects I felt with this movie is in large part to do to what didn’t play – take place in previous films, particularly Half-Blood Prince. And I felt that they really missed the boat to show just how much danger Voldemort presented to the rest of the world.
Andrew: Which they emphasized a lot in the beginning of Half-Blood Prince.
Micah: Well, yes and no because I think if they would have done the “Other Minister” scene, sort of that transfer of power from Fudge to Scrimgeour and then meeting with the British Prime Minister, it would have made people realize just how much danger he did present, the gravity of the situation, so to speak. And I think that when this all transfers over to that road opera with the trio traveling in the woods – if they would have developed that earlier, it would have made this all make a little bit more sense and more believable. And that’s what…
Eric: You’re saying people need to know more about how Voldemort poses a threat to non-wizards?
Micah: Exactly, because I – and to show the danger that he presents to…
Micah: …the real world.
Eric: …the only cast – the only characters in this film are wizards and…
Micah: Right, but…
Eric: …the whole movie is about wizards.
Micah: …they are traveling in the “real world.”
Andrew: Right. I mean, they go…
Micah: When they go to the forest they are in the real world and there is this danger of these other wizards attacking them in the Muggle world. They’re no longer in the magical world anymore and I think that that’s where Deathly Hallows really just – it lost itself when they transferred over to the road opera, so to speak.
Richard: Yeah, I completely agree. I don’t think this film at all managed to capture the sense of fear that the trio had throughout or the entire wizarding world has throughout, the whole fear of what Voldemort’s up to and he’s killing everyone. And the only time you even got a slight reference to that was when Ron was playing with the radio, and the only way the film sort of personified was that Harry didn’t like it and Harry got annoyed with it. And there’s no other real way of capturing what the world is feeling right now, and I thought that was my biggest letdown of the entire film.
Micah: Yeah. And just on Scrimgeour, one more point. I think if they would have introduced him a movie earlier – and Eric, you mentioned the fact that there was sort of this pre-existing relationship that nobody really got because they didn’t introduce him in Half-Blood Prince – people would have had a better idea of just how they felt toward each other. And it’s not even stated in this movie that perhaps the most influential and powerful government official in the wizarding world just died for Harry Potter.
Micah: It’s mentioned in passing by Kingsley’s Patronus that the Minister is dead, but you have no idea how that impacts Harry in terms of him moving forward as a character, so…
Eric: Right, because didn’t he refuse to give over Harry’s whereabouts or something like that?
Richard: He did, yeah.
Eric: Yeah. So, he refused to believe that the Ministry was corrupt and then at the very last moments of his life, when he was forced to believe that the Ministry was corrupt, he didn’t sell Harry out.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Mad-Eye Moody’s Death
Andrew: Well, speaking of deaths, were you guys satisfied with the reaction to Mad-Eye’s death? I mean, it does come very sudden in the book. Did you like how it was transferred to the movie? Personally for me, it felt…
Andrew: It did feel a bit rushed, but I hate to say that because it’s, like, how long do you want to actually dwell on that?
Micah: Well, I feel though…
Micah: The way it was introduced, though, was poor. I think it was Bill who said, “Mad-Eye’s dead.”
Andrew: Yeah, yeah.
Micah: And here’s a character…
Andrew: I agree.
Micah: If it was delivered by a character that we had seen throughout the other movies it might have been more impactful. Having Bill do it, I thought – it was just, like, “Oh, Mad-Eye’s dead,” and it didn’t have any emotion behind it.
Eric: I think the emphasis – I think using Bill to do it was the right thing. Bill was, I think, the right choice as an actor. I think they cast him well, he looks just like the others, so I believe instantly when he’s, like, “Hey, I’m Bill Weasley.” Oh okay, so that’s Bill, I just went with it. And when he says Mad-Eye is dead, he is sad about it. And the fact that somebody we’ve never met can be that sad about Mad-Eye’s death shows that there is a larger world. It shows that there is this larger Order, people we haven’t maybe even considered, who are affected by Mad-Eye’s death, who are affected by the deaths of these characters we do know.
Micah: Well, no. I mean, it comes after a very comedic moment where George talks about being holey. And then you just get that quick one-liner, “Mad-Eye’s dead.”
Eric: They weren’t sure about it.
Micah: I don’t think it was delivered well, in my opinion.
Richard: Yeah, I agree with you, Micah.
Andrew: I agree. You nailed it. The introduction was my problem with it because – yeah. I mean, you just met this character, Bill. Most people really still don’t know [laughs] who he is. And they don’t spend too much time on it, but that was okay with me because you’ve got to keep the pace of the film moving and maybe a little more reflection would have been okay.
Eric: Yeah, I just think that they really – their concern was George. I mean, not everybody had returned immediately. And when George lost his ear, the Weasleys, obviously their main concern is going to be their own, who is cursed. It was each other at first and then when mostly everybody arrived, they were able to focus on George. So, I don’t know when they would have announced Moody’s death if it were sooner than that. And I guess I can see kind of where you’re coming from, that it was Bill, a periphery character, to say it. But I think they – I think it all meant the same to them and I’m glad they didn’t dwell on it anymore.
Micah: Yeah, but there wasn’t even a question from, say, Arthur or Remus, “Where’s Mad-Eye?”
Eric: I felt like that was just synonymous with how life changes suddenly like that. It’s kind of – I guess it was supposed to be like a shock to everybody but to also the audience, that this character who had just been making jokes about goblin piss – Fred and George were taking the piss out of him for that…
Eric: …is just gone. No longer going to be in the film, he gets no outro, he gets no nothing. It’s just boom, he’s dead, and I think that was the intended effect.
Andrew: Closing point, Richard.
Richard: Oh, all right. I was just wondering when George lost his ear, was there any reference to Snape since he was the one that actually did it?
Richard: Because that could be important because I’m assuming they’re going to have a montage in the next film about Snape’s good side and there was no reference to that at all. I thought it would be a nice entry point.
Andrew: It is kind of weird that they really didn’t play up the Snape, “Do we trust Snape?” angle…
Richard: Not at all.
Andrew: …in promoting this film at all because with the book it was such a big question and maybe because they figured everybody knows the outcome anyway or most people do. But…
Micah: Yeah, he got very little screen time other than just really the opening few minutes.
Micah: And that was it, right? I mean, he didn’t appear at all in the rest of the film.
Eric: Although interestingly, Harry is looking at the Marauder’s Map at one scene after he hears on the radio that Snape is the new headmaster, so there is those little bits…
Eric: …but they are easy to miss, but there are those little bits.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Bill and Fleur’s Wedding
Andrew: Yeah. So, let’s get to the wedding scene. Of course we don’t see the actual wedding, we just see the after-party. And Harry is sitting there talking with Muriel, and she gives some information about Dumbledore and Harry starts to distrust him. And that’s one of the main themes of this film, is, “Can Harry trust Dumbledore?” and the viewer is supposed to take that in, too. So, I personally don’t think that it was emphasized enough.
Micah: Yeah, I agree. I completely agree here with you. I thought they did – this is the only part where they developed sort of the distrust of Dumbledore, and then they don’t revisit it all throughout the course of the movie. This is it, when you have that…
Andrew: Well, they do a little bit when Ron says, “Oh, we’re chasing down all these Horcruxes, and…”
Andrew: “…Dumbledore didn’t give you any information?”
Micah: But as far as his background, as far as sort of the plan that has been laid out for Harry – or lack thereof – as Harry goes through and learns more and more from the book that Rita Skeeter wrote, there’s just – you don’t hear much about him. And I felt like this was a great opportunity because I think when we read Deathly Hallows, we all questioned Dumbledore. I mean, Eric, you were the one who said he raised him like a pig for slaughter…
Eric: Which he did.
Micah: …and that was not even touched on in this movie after the wedding scene where Harry is sitting down with Muriel and Elphias Doge.
Eric: I think you’ve got to look at a few key things. The first is that Hermione – in the movie, Hermione is the one reading The Life and Lies of Albus Dumbledore. She picks it up at Bathilda’s house quite late in the film and is shown only about halfway through it, I think, in a scene closer to the end of the film. So, she’s still kind of picking up things about it. It’s kind of like you wait until the end of the book to do a book review. So, I’m saying maybe a lot of that will come into play in Part 2, especially when they are going to introduce Aberforth because they made such a big deal about the mirror and we can talk about that later. But little things like casting the photographs of Grindelwald and Dumbledore that are in the book, I feel like the groundwork is all laid. I didn’t feel shorted at all on the, “Dumbledore, can we trust him?” subplot, particularly because whoever they got to cast as Muriel is a freaking bitch.
Eric: She just tore Harry apart and…
Andrew: Her costume was amazing, though, what she was wearing.
Eric: A friend of mine made the comment – they didn’t feel it was right to include the characters of Elphias Doge and Aunt Muriel in the film because they are periphery and my friend felt that they could do more with the actual main characters if they had those characters do some of the exposition. But again, my feelings on that – if I can echo them here if anybody else is feeling that way. Again, outsiders who we as the film viewers have never met talking about Dumbledore, who even the film viewers should know, again it gives the illusion of the wider world – the wider wizarding world. Characters we’ve never met talking about someone we know intimately and casting a different shadow on him, I think that was fine. Plus not to mention, it’s canon to have those characters and I thought they were well acted.
Micah: I think that it would have been better if Harry would have questioned Dumbledore more throughout the course of this film because you’re just left with Aunt Muriel saying to Harry, “Honestly boy, how well did you really know him?” and that’s it, and that was my problem, ultimately.
Andrew: They drove that point home, too, because they got a close up of her and…
Andrew: …it was like they really emphasized that. And by the way, that was our little cameo from Rita Skeeter, Miranda Richardson, so…
Eric: What, on the back of the book?
Andrew: Yeah, on the back of the book. That’s what she came in to film. [laughs]
Eric: [laughs] Her winking suggestively?
Andrew: Right. “Check out my book!” So, that was the wedding scene and then we get to…
Eric: Well, Kingsley’s Patronus, not fully formed. Why not?
Andrew: Not fully formed – yeah. Well, maybe…
Eric: And what’s with those faces?
Andrew: I think they didn’t fully form Kingsley’s Patronus because a regular viewer would not know why it’s in the shape – why it’s in a particular shape.
Eric: But then there’s the silver doe. Do you think if they would have filmed or fully formed Kingsley’s Patronus that maybe they didn’t want the audience to know that the silver doe exactly, specifically was a Patronus?
Micah: Well, they also had Umbridge’s in the Ministry, though.
Eric: Oh, and that was so cool. I just noticed…
Andrew: That was cool. I loved that.
Eric: …for the first time last night that that was what was keeping the Dementors at bay in the court scene.
Andrew: Yeah, that was awesome.
Eric: I hadn’t realized that.
Micah: Did anybody else not feel as much of an impact as when you read it in the book about Kingsley’s statement that the Ministry had fallen?
Richard: Yeah, I thought it was dragging out and he was sort of telling a short story as opposed to saying, “Hey, get the hell out of here!”
Micah: Because it was a “holy bleep” moment in the books. And this, it didn’t come across that way. The same way I didn’t feel the ending came across either, but we’ll talk about that later.
Eric: “They are coming, they are coming.”
Andrew: By the way, Viktor Krum, completely cut out of the wedding.
Eric: Change number two. Change number two.
Andrew: He did – he was in your screening, Eric?
Andrew: In the Chicago…
Eric: There’s a scene where Hermione talks to Krum or she goes up to him. He kind of says hi and then he looks at her like he recognizes her and stuff, but then a Veela girl passes, and he actually just turns and walks away. So, they filmed it and he probably got paid to be in this movie, but they cut him out of the film.
Andrew: At least he got his pay, and hopefully we’ll see him on the DVD.
Eric: Actually, that’s what I liked about the wedding, too. I just realized there were some Beauxbatons girls there and I thought that was – obviously it’s important to include them. But they were dressed in their blue uniform from the fourth movie. There were just a few scattered around the wedding in the background and I thought maybe the film – I think that’s kind of a testament to the Department of Costuming. They said, “Hey, we need some old school friends of Fleur’s here.”
MuggleCast 214 Transcript (continued)
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Cafe Attack
Andrew: So, the trio get the heck out of there and then suddenly they are in London. And I thought this was good, the transfer, the Apparating to London. And they, of course, land right in front of a double decker bus, so they move out of the way very quickly. And then Hermione gets them into new clothes and they go into the cafe where there is a Snatcher attack. And I thought that was funny because the waitress…
Andrew: …is completely oblivious to what’s going on until she walks out…
Micah: Yeah, that was good.
Andrew: …and – was it Hermione who says “Leave!” or was it Harry?
Eric: Yeah, it was Hermione.
Andrew: Hermione. “Leave!” [laughs]
Micah: Well, and this was the first instance where the taboo was used…
Micah: …but they don’t realize it. And I thought again they didn’t really explain this at all in the film. Not sure that they had to, but I think it would have been – it would have made more sense for people to figure that out because then you could go back to the different moments in the film that they said the name “Voldemort,” and all of a sudden these Snatchers showed up.
Eric: Yeah. I mean, Harry is shown saying “You Know Who” in one scene and it seems almost – it was jarring that he says “You Know Who” and we aren’t explained why he just doesn’t say “Voldemort.”
Richard: I picked up on that as well and I almost wondered why. I mean, what was the point of it? I guess because they didn’t really want to explain the whole taboo thing.
Andrew: [laughs] Yeah.
Eric: Well, later – okay, when Lovegood says it, when Xeno says it, obviously that’s the moment when they come. But you’re wondering if – because there was also that crow that was flying away from the place to start The Three Brothers scene…
Eric: …so we’re wondering if he sent a letter, though.
Eric: But then when he says “Voldemort” is when they actually show up, so it’s kind of – but it’s still not explained and like I said, Harry does say “You Know Who” in one scene he’s talking to Hermione. You can use the name freely with Hermione, but he doesn’t and it’s not explained.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Grimmauld Place
Andrew: The trio then goes to Grimmauld Place and they see the Dumbledore sand/ghost figure thing, and that wasn’t explained too much. It was sort of just like, oh, it was probably put in place for Snape.
Andrew: But it’s like – any viewer would just think, “Well, if Snape saw that, wouldn’t he just stand there and scream like Hermione did?” [laughs]
Richard: I thought that was quite terrifying, though. That whole scene was one of the scariest in the entire film.
Andrew: It was. And then they’re sort of searching around the house and we see Kreacher. And Kreacher looked good and he sounded good, and I think he didn’t change too much from Order of the Phoenix in terms of visual appearance and I liked him. Any comments about Grimmauld Place?
Andrew: This part of Grimmauld Place?
Micah: I think this moved really fast. This whole part – figuring out who R.A.B. was, sending Kreacher after Mundungus, finding out where the locket was, and then getting to the Ministry. It was very fast-paced, so I wonder if non-fans of the books are going to get completely lost in terms of what’s going on here because it did move very quickly.
Eric: It did. There was a lot of kind of story elements that were just thrown in there.
Eric: Like them rereading the locket for instance.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Ministry of Magic
Andrew: They then head to the Ministry of Magic and they turn into the Ministry members. This was pretty funny because the way that these other actors portrayed Harry, Ron, and Hermione, in terms of their walk, their talk, their ‘isms,’ they were very well done. And I think at the junket interviews or somewhere, one of the billion interviews that have been online in the past few weeks, the trio said that they would first act out the scenes and then these Ministry of Magic actors would then mimic them.
Andrew: So, the trio was there, too, filming alongside and I thought that was a cool idea.
Micah: I’m going to go out on a limb. I’m going to say that this was some of the best acting in the entire film.
Richard: I agree. Yeah, I agree.
Andrew: Really? Why?
Eric: Was done by the strangers?
Andrew: Why do you like it, Richard?
Richard: Well to be honest, in the entire film I kind of thought Daniel Radcliffe’s acting was really wooden in a lot of scenes. I mean, he has improved a lot as the films have gone on, but sometimes he comes across as very, very fake and very dense and very uninspiring. And I thought that these scenes in particular, [laughs] I thought they came alive more mostly because he wasn’t in them and…
Eric: Wow! Tell us how you really feel.
Andrew: Go ahead, go on. No, stand by your opinion. Go ahead.
Richard: Well, I just thought – there is a nice sort of irony to that, is that I thought…
Richard: That was my favorite scene in the entire film – was the Ministry. And I thought…
Eric: In a Harry Potter film.
Richard: Yeah, I know! Exactly, there’s an irony to that. But I just thought that those actors delivered a more credible performance than Dan can give.
Eric: Well, he’s got a few years. [laughs]
Micah: Just to throw it out there, Runcorn was David O’Hara, Mafalda Hopkirk was Sophie Thompson, who is the sister, I think, of Emma Thompson, right?
Richard: They were brilliant though.
Micah: Reg Cattermole was played by Steffan Rhodri. So…
Eric: Yeah, I think Reg was my favorite.
Micah: …put them up for Academy Awards.
Richard: I think all three were just brilliant.
Andrew: They were good, yeah. So, they get into the court room. And when they’re going around the Ministry, that was very funny. I mean, going into the elevators, running into Umbridge. Imelda Staunton was as great as ever, I thought.
Eric: She does the laugh. She does the laugh.
Micah: She’s awesome. But can I…
Micah: Can I throw one thing out there though? You talked about going around the Ministry, the fact that Harry didn’t take the eye off the door, of Mad Eye?
Andrew: Oh, yeah.
Micah: Such an easy thing to do that they left out and…
Micah: …there’s no reflection at all from Harry in that scene. When he saw it, he should have reacted a little bit better, I thought.
Eric: Yeah, it’s kind of one of those things where they’re expecting the audience to recognize it, but it gets no pay. Like the mirror scene, they’re at – Harry is in Sirius’s room and still he has this mirror whose origins are unexplained. It’s never explained how he got the mirror. He picks it up at the very beginning of the film when he is in his bedroom at Privet Drive, and later on in the film we see him in Sirius’s bedroom. He could have picked up the mirror at that point in the film, and they just didn’t do it. Missed opportunity, or what was going on?
Andrew: Yeah. Well, speaking of the mirror, I was very disappointed with that whole thing because there is no introduction for the mirror, either. You just see Harry looking at it and suddenly you see what some would probably figure out to be Dumbledore’s eye, but it’s not even Dumbledore’s, it’s Aberfoth Dumbledore’s, and there is just no explanation. And I counted – he picks it up three or four times…
Andrew: …in this movie.
Eric: Well, we did have a pretty lengthy discussion on MuggleCast about this. I think it was last episode where you guys were asking me about this and I want to get your thoughts on that, but I also want to stick to the points here, quickly.
Andrew: Yeah, let’s – well, we can…
Eric: Yeah. But when they flush themselves in – okay, when public servants have to flush…
[Andrew and Micah laugh]
Eric: …themselves in to work…
Micah: That was funny.
Eric: It’s the best. It’s the best ever. I just loved that.
Andrew: That was good. So, when they get down into the courtroom, Umbridge is there and like Eric mentioned earlier, the Patronus keeping the Dementors at bay. That was really – that was pretty well done and it was nice to see Umbridge’s Patronus, which of course was the kitty cat.
Eric: Did you guys notice the music notes emanating from the cat? There was the Patronus and then there’s these little music staff notes like…
Eric: …you would normally see – that’s what was coming…
Andrew: That seems to ring a bell.
Eric: It was coming from the cat and floating up to the barrier to prevent the barrier – so the cat was singing or something. It was really interesting.
Andrew: And this was one of my favorite parts of the movie I think, actually, when Harry slowly starts walking up to Umbridge and Umbridge says, “What are you doing?” And Harry throws the spell at her…
Eric: And he’s transforming…
Andrew: …and then all hell breaks loose.
Eric: …as it happens.
Andrew: Yeah, exactly, exactly. [laughs] And now what did you guys think – this is, of course, a change from the book. What did you guys think of when Ron is transforming back into himself mid-kiss? For a theater, I guess, it’s very funny. It’s very, “Oh haha, of course he transforms back mid-kiss.” That’s not in the book, though. Did you guys like that?
Eric: I think…
Richard: …it was all right.
Eric: …it was an effort…
Micah: It was funny.
Eric: Yeah, to diffuse the tension, too, because this poor Mary character has gone through…
Andrew: [laughs] Yeah.
Eric: …so much. So much, really. And everybody in the Ministry is wearing red bands, like they are the S.S. It’s this really heavy allegory of people being persecuted and the fact that – the look on Mary’s face when she kisses Ron and then, of course, the real Reg just walks into work at that moment. It’s just this – the look on her face. She is terrified, she doesn’t know what to say.
Micah: Well, I think it’s supposed to show Ron’s development as a character too, though…
Micah: …when he says to her, “Take the kids and go.”
Eric: “Take the kids,” yeah.
Micah: You’re supposed to see a different side of Ron that you haven’t seen up until this point. And Andrew what you mentioned – I also liked the tie back to Order of the Phoenix when Harry says to Umbridge, “You shall not tell lies.”
Richard: Yeah, I liked that.
Andrew: Yeah, that was good. That was good.
Richard: The only thing I didn’t like about the Ministry-whole scenes – and this is kind of a petty thing to argue about – is that I always felt that they’re starting to lose a touch of the magic to it. You notice that no one was really wearing wizarding robes any longer. Security guards were dressed like regular cops or whatever. And I was kind of expecting to see people dressed as wizards, not as Muggles in the Ministry of Magic.
Eric: That’s a fair point. Yeah, I agree. I would agree to an extent. I would say – again it’s kind of Nazi Germany, so everybody is wearing the same thing and it’s not going to be extravagant. It’s going to be dull tones, dull outfits sort of thing, and everybody alike – uniformity. That’s what I would argue.
Micah: What did you guys think of Yaxley? He was in Malfoy Manor, but he was also in this particular scene. He reminded me…
Andrew: I loved him.
Richard: I thought he was brilliant.
Micah: …of an Italian mobster.
Andrew: Yeah. I thought he got the anger across great.
Eric: [imitating Yaxley] “It’s still raining in my office.”
Andrew: I mean, you can just see his anger when he starts chasing after Harry, Ron and Hermione. And those scenes, by the way, were great too, where Harry, Ron and Hermione are running towards the fireplace to get out of the Ministry. And there was sort of a slowish – or a shot that sort of slowed down, and you see Ron running and then his mouth is gaping open, like, ahh!
Eric: And then he – yeah.
Andrew: And that transition, too, was great. I thought…
Andrew: …when they get in the fireplace and it sort of – you see the roots of the trees and then they see the silhouettes of the trees. And then they sort of just come up and then they are on the road.
Eric: Well, the silence of the music – just the soundtrack is dead and you see these trees and you know something is wrong way before you see Ron Splinched.
Micah: Yeah. And Yaxley, I think – he’s almost like a horror-movie character, like a Michael Myers. He’s slowly stalking them. He doesn’t start to run after them until he absolutely needs to. It’s kind of like a slow gait to catch them like he almost knows that eventually he’s going to get his hands on them.
Eric: Yeah. He’s such a – he’s a good actor too. Again with finding the Polyjuiced trio actors and Yaxley, all these new actors – new adult actors, there were still some left in Britain apparently because they…
Eric: …cast them in this film and they were awesome.
Micah: Yeah, I agree.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Camping in the Forest
Andrew: So, now they’re on the road and this is the thing that they had been promoting a lot where it’s going to be a road movie. They’re going to be on the road, living on their own. And these scenes in particular were unique in that it’s just these three and they sort of – they have to hold the scenes up on their own because in the past, they’re surrounded by these great British actors or fellow Hogwarts students. For this part of the movie it’s just these three, and I have to be honest and say I thought this is where the movie drags a bit.
Micah: Yeah, absolutely.
Andrew: Most people felt that way with the book, I think. There’s still a lot of information being shared around the trio and of course, there’s the big fight and the destroying of the Horcrux and Godric’s Hollow. But it still felt like it dragged. Micah, why did you think it dragged?
Micah: I think it goes back to what I said earlier. The lack of development that took place prior to this film of Voldemort’s threat to the Muggle world, and just why they would have to be on the run and maybe why the Muggle world is a bit safer than being in the wizarding world. Why not just go back under the protection of the Order of the Phoenix? Why are they on the run going to all these different places around England? It doesn’t make a whole lot of sense and I…
Micah: Go ahead.
Eric: It’s not only – they have a job to do, let’s not forget. So, they’re on the run just out of convenience because they need to find Horcruxes and that’s really why they are in the woods to begin with. It’s – they’re only in the woods essentially because Hermione had to escape from the Ministry, needed a place to go immediately after finding the Horcrux. And they stay in the woods because their job there isn’t finished, they need to figure out how to destroy the Horcrux. One of the earliest scenes in the woods is them trying to destroy the locket with all sorts of spells. They are unsuccessful and thus begins sort of the trek. It’s not only they’re in the woods because they’re hiding from Voldemort. They need the time and the place…
Eric: …and the space to be able to develop the end of Voldemort. So, it’s the plot, it’s the main beef of the film. I feel like if you feel it drags here, then you’re more inclined to dislike the whole film.
Andrew: Richard, did you feel it dragged or were you a fan of these scenes?
Richard: I felt it dragged, but as I said earlier, I thought Emma Watson held this whole section of the film together. I thought – and Rupert Grint was very good as well but you really got the most from Emma, particularly when Ron stormed off and she had to choose whether she helped Harry or she goes with Ron. And you could see the tears in her eyes and you believed it, and that – I thought she was sort of the shining beacon in that whole section of the movie, which otherwise I thought was kind of dull and prolonged.
Micah: Yeah, I think Ron summed it up the best when he had the locket around his neck and he was clearly angry about the lack of information that Dumbledore had provided to Harry. I kind of felt that way as a fan, too, that we didn’t get as much coming up to this point to really understand what was going on.
Micah: And that’s why I feel…
Eric: And in the books we had so much more.
Micah: Yeah, exactly. And I feel – and look, I understand book-to-film adaptation, there’s only so much that you can do. But I felt that there were integral things that were left out prior to this point that allowed this to drag maybe more than it had to.
Eric: There’s the third change I noticed between the pre-screening and the final film is there is a moment they’re walking through the tall grass when they’re in the woods, when they’re on the road, and it’s a fairly open field and there is tall grass. And they kind of just keep going and it’s one of those I want to say montages. It’s not a montage, but Ron is watching Harry and Hermione kind of work together. Well, the scene originally, there was a moment where Ron stops them, and they’re in the middle of the field and he says, “What’s the game plan?” And Harry turns to him and says, “We’re just going to keep going.”
Eric: And Ron says, “Isn’t that what we’ve been doing? Like the day before that and the day before that, and the day before that?” And Harry kind of – he is taken aback and then Hermione is, like, “Ron.” And so there is some dissent there. There is this short moment where it’s really, I guess, to help the passage of time, is what it originally was for because they have been doing this for weeks and weeks and weeks, and all of a sudden it’s snowing. So, it was cut out but I think it still played well because the very, very next scene is when Ron does have the locket on and they are in the tent, and he says pretty much the same stuff. So, it was condensed maybe or that scene was removed, but I think it was still fine. It’s one of those things that I really want to see on the deleted scenes because they are in a big open space and Ron is causing problems, so it’s kind of significant.
Andrew: Let’s try to get through these wood scenes particularly quickly. There were four that I listed here as standouts. Ron and Harry’s fight, which was very good, and Richard, you had mentioned earlier that Dan’s acting was kind of stiff. But here, I thought this was his standout scene. It felt very real between Harry and Ron, so I thought the acting was great.
Andrew: Would anyone agree/disagree with that?
Richard: I would agree. I almost thought they hated each other in real life, it was so convincing.
[Andrew and Eric laugh]
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Godric’s Hollow
Andrew: Yeah. And that was good because the last thing you want is for that to be fake and I think a lot of viewers really connected with that. Then Godric’s Hollow which probably was one of the more interesting parts of the woods, in terms of action going on. We see Harry and Hermione at his parents’ grave which was a nice addition, as well as Bathilda being basically – turning into the snake. You could tell right from the start that she’s creepy as hell but Harry was just so determined to get any sort of information out of her and of course, that backfired.
Eric: Well, she speaks Parseltongue.
Andrew: [laughs] Yeah, and like…
Eric: When she finally does speak, she speaks a little bit of Parseltongue. It’s not subtitled, we don’t know what she’s saying.
Andrew: Why Harry did not just run at that point, I have no idea unless he was stalling so Hermione could look around.
Andrew: That was the one thing I was thinking.
Eric: Hermione discovering that room with the blood in it and the flies, a decaying corpse…
Andrew: [laughs] Yeah.
Eric: It’s really – I feel like there was a little bit more of that in the pre-screening, but…
Andrew: Oh, but one other thing before we get to the dance, which I can’t believe I didn’t list that here. When ñ I had seen it twice, I saw it at a screening in London ñ so I, like most people who saw it the first time, jumped back when the snake comes jumping out from the lower level in Godric’s Hollow. Well, for the second time that I saw it, I knew it was coming and I was sitting towards the back of the theater, so instead of watching the screen I was just staring at the audience. [laughs] And the entire theater backed up and just lurched when the snake jumped out that time. And then for the next few, like seriously, solid thirty seconds, everyone was just laughing [laughs] because everybody was so scared by that scene.
Eric: It’s such a movie…
Eric: It’s so common, but it still works as a movie technique.
Andrew: Right, it gets you every time.
Andrew: Yep. [laughs]
Micah: One thing…
Andrew: Thank god that wasn’t in 3D. [laughs]
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: The Deathly Hallows Symbol
Micah: One thing I wanted to bring up, though, was the symbol, also, the Deathly Hallows symbol. I felt like they kind of just made it show up in different places but didn’t really explain it that well. I mean – and the reason why I bring it up…
Eric: Well, Hermione ties it together.
Micah: …is because it shows up on the grave – yeah, but it was – I don’t feel like it was developed that well, either. You saw it on Xenophilius Lovegood at the wedding, then you saw it on the grave, and it was kind of like this whole underlying story of the Deathly Hallows. And I’m sure we’ll talk about it when we get to the animation scene. It was just kind of…
Eric: Where else was it in the book – I mean, that it would be in the film? I feel like they touched – they had it in all the moments.
Micah: Not to us, to the regular viewer. It kind of moved very quickly and I don’t know that a lot of people will catch on to it.
Eric: Well, Hermione specifically lists all the times that they were able to – that they saw that symbol to Xenophilius and there is this – literally, it lasted for sixty to eighty seconds where he has the piece of chalk and he draws – after we hear the story, he draws out the symbol, so it’s really – the time spent, I thought, was just fine on that symbol. And maybe there are more implications about that, obviously Harry at one point has to discover that he has two of the three Hallows already on his person, but that’s something for Part 2.
Richard: Going back to the Godric’s Hollow section, one of my favorite scenes from the book was when Voldemort appeared and then had that flashback to when – the night when he was destroyed almost, and I was really disappointed that didn’t make the film whatsoever.
Eric: Well, you know what’s weird, wasn’t there – there was a shot when Harry and Hermione are standing in front of the house, the destroyed house. Harry has some kind of flash and there is Lily’s body on the ground, laying – there’s a crib and it’s turned over, like, split second. Did you guys see that?
Richard: I don’t remember that bit.
Eric: It felt like ó yeah, it was really just a few seconds but it looked like a further shot of Harry’s parents maybe mid-attack or after they had just been attacked. It was really weird.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Destroying the Locket Horcrux
Andrew: Let’s talk about Ron returning and destroying the Horcrux. I think this again was pretty funny because Hermione is so pissed when Ron comes back [laughs] and asks Harry for her wand back, which was very funny. And the acting was just great, I loved that.
Eric: I thought that was one of those scenes that was obligatory for the audience. Ron visibly repentant, Hermione visibly reluctant to forgive Ron, and then some cheesy lines about, “Want to put it to a vote? I vote we go with Hermione.” It’s funny and I really enjoyed it, but I ñ what are you going to do? You’re condensing a lot of emotions right now, so…
Andrew: I am jumping a little ahead though, of course, Ron destroying the Horcrux happens right before this. Did you guys like when the Horcrux gets opened by Harry and then we see the Horcrux talking smack on Ron, and then Harry and Hermione ñ the vision, they’re nude, making out, we see side-boob.
Andrew: Eric Scull, your thoughts on the side-boob.
Eric: Okay, copious side-boob is the – okay, there is more of this scene than there was in the pre-release because the effects weren’t completed, so there is a shot and they go back to them embracing, and they’re actually really, really making out. But the problem I have is that Hermione’s bust is visibly enhanced. And I mean, you can tell it’s enhanced, or at least I can tell. I noticed it…
Andrew: It’s not the real…
Eric: It’s not the real deal…
Eric: …and originally when I first saw it it was the real deal, and it’s going to be impossible for me to ever see that again and I’m really upset about that because they have enhanced it. It looks fake…
Andrew: So, they sexed it up a bit.
Eric: …and they took me right out of the moment.
Andrew: They sexed it up.
Eric: They sexed it up just like they did – I think it was The Order of the Phoenix movie poster.
Andrew: The IMAX poster.
Eric: There were two versions.
Andrew: They added some…
Eric: Yeah, the IMAX movie poster. They…
Andrew: They enhanced Hermione’s chest.
Micah: Or when Slughorn was checking out Hermione. Do you remember that in the Half-Blood Prince poster?
Andrew: No. Was that…
Eric: Oh yeah, he has that look.
Andrew: Oh. [laughs]
Eric: And it’s that. Yeah.
Andrew: But did…
Eric: Okay, so – yeah.
Andrew: Did you guys like this? I thought it came off really well. It was really a shining moment for Ron and Rupert’s acting.
Eric: But it was…
Andrew: Which amazes me…
Eric: It could have been better.
Andrew: …because honestly Rupert is such a bad interview. You try to ask him questions and he just cannot put out a comprehensible answer. But then his acting is so good that it’s kind of unbelievable. [laughs] It’s two different people. Or that it’s one person – it’s the same person. Any other thoughts about this?
Micah: Yeah, I thought this scene was good. I liked how the spiders came out first and then…
Micah: …you had Voldemort talking to him about how his mother really wanted a daughter but got Ron instead. And then it transitioned to the whole Harry/Hermione thing. I thought this scene was pretty good.
Andrew: And that, “what are you? What are you…”
Micah: Yeah, exactly.
Andrew: “…to this trio.”
Micah: And the side-boob.
[Andrew and Micah laugh]
Eric: Well, like I said, it took me out of the moment. I feel like it was lesser because I don’t think it looks like it’s real. And maybe it’s not because it’s in Ron’s head, but – I don’t know, I wish they would have reduced – just kept it real. Like, come on, what’s the – there was plenty of side-boob the first time around. I feel like they really enhanced it. I really do and it looks unreal to me.
Andrew: Well, as much as you guys would like to talk about the side-boob all day, we can’t. So, we’ll move on to – well, I guess that’s it for this portion of the woods.
Eric: We skipped the silver doe, we skipped the…
Andrew: Oh okay, yeah. But is there much to talk about with that silver doe?
Eric: Well, it just – I want to make the comment, it seems plausible that Snape would be there in the woods, just out of sight. It seemed plausible. Do you guys agree? Because at this point, there is so much less Snape in this film, I guess, than there is in the – well, at this point it’s just not explained at all, but it seemed plausible that Snape had been searching for the trio.
Micah: Well, I think – and I’d hope that it would be a flashback of sorts when you get that moment between Harry and Snape, and he takes a look at his memory in Part 2. I’d hope that you get a flashback to this particular scene as well…
Micah: …so you kind of see how he’s been playing double agent the whole time.
Richard: How does he even find out? Because there is no picture of the guy from Grimmauld Place which is also another portrait in Dumbledore’s office, so how does Snape even find out about what their current location is?
Eric: You mean Phineas Nigellus?
Eric: Yeah, he’s unable to discern their situation from the portrait.
Micah: Oh yeah, because Hermione takes the portrait, right…
Eric: I don’t know.
Micah: …along with them?
Eric: Yeah, and they were talking to – she mentions specifically being in the Forest of Dean where she’s never been before.
Andrew: David Yates specifically takes that out, actually. He said when I interviewed him – we asked how do you decide what to take out, what to keep in, in terms of adapting. And he specifically mentioned that one thing – [laughs] Hermione taking the portrait. They purposely left that out, so – that doesn’t add anything but…
Richard: But how did Snape find them? Well, it will be interesting to see how they explain that in the next film, I guess.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Harry and Hermione’s Dance
Andrew: Yeah. Snape will just be, like, “I was watching you,” with no real explanation. One other thing that…
Eric: Harry and Hermione dancing?
Andrew: Yes, Harry and Hermione dancing. Dan, he’s quoted as saying that this – Harry Potter has never felt more real than this scene because it’s a great song by…
Eric: Nick Cave.
Andrew: Nick Cave. Thank you. Eric, do you know the name of the song?
Eric: Yeah, “O Children.” And it has parenthesis…
Andrew: Yeah, I love the song. I thought it was a perfect match. David Yates said he spent a lot of time, he went through hundreds of songs trying to find the perfect one that would give off a sense of hope, but also that there is still some trouble going on. So…
Eric: They’re still kids, you know?
Andrew: They’re still kids.
Eric: And Dan’s dancing – I didn’t notice this the first time. The second time I saw this – his dancing is just so cheesy.
Andrew: Same. Yeah, I didn’t notice this the first time either, but…
Eric: Yeah, it’s Dan Harry. It’s Felix Felicis Harry, basically, trying to find a happy moment. And later, I guess I heard somewhere that the trio was instructed – or Dan and Emma were instructed to play that scene as if it would end in their kissing.
Eric: Because there is this great moment at the end of it where there is that tension for only the tiniest of seconds and obviously they come to themselves, they pull back. But it’s not – it’s just so tender.
Andrew: Yeah, I have to say, I was almost fooled. As someone who has read the books and knows the outcome, I thought Harry and Hermione were going to kiss. [laughs] They were getting pretty close and – but I’ve told this to a couple of people now and they were, like, “What are you talking about? I didn’t feel that way at all.”
Richard: I thought they would as well.
Eric: Yeah. But I’m glad they didn’t, obviously. But I think that the tenderness is something that’s real. It’s real acting from both of them.
Eric: And it’s just something that I think is one of the biggest points of this film, is just the acting from the kids.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: The Tale of the Three Brothers
Andrew: So next up, the Lovegood’s home. When the trio get to the Lovegood’s home and we see Xenophilius Lovegood for the first time. And he – well, not for the first time. We saw him at the wedding as well.
Eric: The second time.
Andrew: And we see the big Three Brothers animation which everyone, critic or not, whether you like the story or not – everyone seemed to be in agreement that this animation was just very well done.
Eric: Yeah. This animation was completely completed. It’s almost like they sent it away to another company that does these for a living and had commissioned it.
Andrew: Yeah, they hired a separate – someone outside of who normally does Harry Potter stuff to work on this and it was inspired…
Andrew: …by Chinese shadow puppets and some other work as well. I mean, it was fun to watch.
Eric: It’s brilliant.
Andrew: Of course…
Eric: I am so happy that they had that completed in time for the pre-screening because it was the entire scene just as it is.
Andrew: Oh, good.
Eric: Because obviously they are not going to change it because it’s either they have the product or they don’t…
Eric: …if they outsource it. So…
Andrew: Of course, the glaring change here was Hermione reading the story, telling the story, rather than Ollivander, which I thought was a bit odd when you think about it because then it’s, like, “Well, why did they go to the Lovegood’s house in the first place if Hermione had the story the whole time? Couldn’t she have figured this out? Couldn’t she have…
Eric: No, she hasn’t.
Eric: She didn’t make that connection.
Andrew: …she figures out everything, [laughs] so…
Andrew: You know what I mean?
Andrew: She could have, so – I don’t know.
Micah: Well, yeah…
Andrew: It would have been nice if they kept how it was in the book with Ollivander.
Micah: I think that – going back to what I said before, with the Deathly Hallows and kind of it being rushed. Eric, the whole symbol thing, I think – and again, look, I understand things need to be left out of the films just from a time standpoint. But the whole scene where Viktor Krum notices the symbol around Xenophilius Lovegood’s neck, he mentions…
Micah: …Gregorovitch. Nobody has a clue who Gregorovitch is in this film.
Micah: Harry passingly comments on him as the wandmaker and – or Hermione, I forget. I think Harry says, “He’s after Gregorovitch,” and Hermione goes, “Oh, the wandmaker?” Well, fans only know…
Micah: …Ollivander up until this point. Who is Gregorovitch? And then the scene, of course, in – what’s it, Nurmengard, I think is the name of the prison? People are – I guarantee you there are going to be people who are lost with that scene, have no idea…
Micah: …what’s going on. And the whole backstory with Grindelwald.
Micah: You have to agree with that, Eric. I mean, he just shows up at the prison, talks to him, gets this fleeting memory out of him, kills him and Harry wakes up. And it’s like…
Eric: Yeah, what I liked about that scene – sorry, go on.
Micah: No, I’m just saying – and then you go to the grave and you see the symbol on Peverell’s grave, and then you go to the Lovegood home. I feel like people who haven’t read the books are not going to follow that storyline and the movie is called Deathly Hallows.
Eric: Well, like…
Eric: The movie is called Deathly Hallows, but like Richard said – okay, Richard brought up the point about Voldemort not being in Bathilda’s. The snake jumps up at the screen, Harry and Hermione Apparate or Disapparate kind of sideways. It reminded me of that scene in Chamber of Secrets when Harry goes through the Floo Network and he shoots out of the fireplace sideways. They basically Disapparate through the wall out of the house, but there is no Voldemort in Godric’s Hollow. And the only Voldemort we get is scenes like this where Harry is dreaming, and Voldemort goes and interviews Gregorovitch, and I think we’re meant to believe it’s Legilimency, that Voldemort is actually physically reading Gregorovitch’s mind because he doesn’t – there is no exposition. And it’s short but I don’t know. I feel like the essentials were there. I mean, to me – maybe this is like offensive, but do you think that they cast the actor who played Gregorovitch as a gay man?
Eric: Because it just came across that way to me.
Andrew: This is irrelevant.
Eric: My gay-dar went off the charts. My gay-dar just went off the charts.
Eric: So, that’s canon.
Eric: That’s canon.
MuggleCast 214 Transcript (continued)
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Dobby
Andrew: …I question your gay-dar. Let’s move on now to the trio at Malfoy Manner. Of course, they get caught by the Snatchers right before this. And we see Dobby and this is not the first time we see Dobby. We saw him a little bit earlier in the film. I loved Dobby in this film. I think even though you have a limited amount of time with him and we haven’t seen since Chamber of Secrets, I think you really get a connection with him. I really was, like, “Awww, Dobby!”
Richard: I don’t agree.
Micah: I can’t say I did.
Micah: I mean, I feel like we’re negative on all these points but I guess it’s good to have sort of the counter-balance. Richard, go ahead, I’ll let you go first.
Richard: Well, I kind of felt cheapened by Dobby. I mean, from a CGI point of view, it was the exact same model as they used in Chamber of Secrets. It looked out of date.
Andrew: But you know what? Can I say…
Eric: I don’t know about that.
Andrew: No, I agree. And the first time we had seen him – in a clip, I think, a few weeks ago – we were, like, “Something looks off about him. What’s wrong?” I think they purposefully left him a bit cartoonish, I dare say, because that way viewers can connect with him a little bit more. He’s not as scary looking as Kreacher, he’s a little more harmless, he comes off a little more friendly. I think they did that on purpose. I think they – and I think he actually looks different than he did in Chamber of Secrets. I think they did that…
Eric: He does look different.
Andrew: …so you felt more emotion towards him. He’s a little more like a stuffed animal or a little pet bunny that you would have in your home.
Richard: I’m not convinced. I mean…
Richard: …the Dobby in the books was covered in clothes and socks and hats because he was free and he loved his clothes. And I just think they took the same model because it was cheaper and it was easier to do that, rather than making a new CGI model for Dobby. I kind of felt a little bit robbed.
Eric: I don’t think I agree with that at all.
Micah: Well, I don’t…
Eric: Sorry, I don’t think the CGI is underdeveloped or in any way the same model that they used eight years ago on the second film. I don’t feel like that’s true at all. It looked just fine to me.
Micah: Well, I’m not going to talk about the CGI side of things though.
Micah: I’ll talk about…
Micah: Sorry to cut you off there. But I’m going to talk about sort of what happens with Dobby, and I thought it was great to have him back because he’s really one of my favorite characters in the entire series. But the free-elf speech, when he’s talking to Bellatrix right before she throws the knife…
Andrew: Don’t you dare say that was bad.
Micah: Not only was it bad, I think…
Micah: …people would have connected with his return a lot more had he been present in the other films because here he is, he’s kind of like this indignant house-elf, basically telling Bellatrix to go screw herself and two seconds later he’s got a knife in his chest. So – and it’s just – he wasn’t developed enough as a character to have him do that and to have him be dead, fifteen, thirty seconds later.
Micah: …as a character to have him do that and to have him be dead fifteen, thirty seconds later.
Eric: Don’t. Don’t, Micah. Micah, don’t blame David Yates for the knife in Dobby’s chest. Blame J.K. Rowling.
Micah: No, I – am I the only one…
Andrew: See, I…
Micah: Am I the only one who thinks that he wasn’t developed enough as a character in previous films to do that to him?
Richard: I agree with you completely. I agree completely.
Andrew: But is any character developed enough…
Andrew: …besides the trio? I mean, they’re all lacking, they all lack. But you just have to go off your knowledge from the books and you have to…
Micah: But not everybody has that.
Andrew: …connect it that way.
Micah: Not everybody has the knowledge from the books…
Micah: …and I’m saying that if – look how much Dobby plays a vital role in the series, even after Chamber of Secrets. And the fact that he hasn’t been around since the second movie and here he is all of a sudden in the final one, it’s like a nice cameo, and then all of a sudden he’s dead. And I don’t think people get the full connection. That’s my point.
Eric: Well, how did you feel about his ending speech? Because his ending speech, the second time I saw this, it seemed to go on for a little bit because…
Andrew: When he was…
Eric: …he’s about to die.
Andrew: When he was stabbed?
Eric: He’s about to die. Yeah. Well, right before he was stabbed, he has this…
Andrew: Oh, that.
Eric: …long conversation.
Andre: Okay, that…
Eric: I mean, Narcissa is in on the conversation. They’re talking back and forth.
Andrew: That was one of my favorite moments. I mean, you see him up there on the chandelier, trying to unscrew it. That was hilarious. Then – and this is based off the audience screening or the fan screening I went to. It was the one at the premiere, so it was a lot of fans. Everybody was cheering during Dobby’s speech. Everyone really got behind him and connected with him. And I didn’t get that the first time I saw the film, so I think the fans really connected with it and I would guarantee that many of the midnight screenings, all the fans were cheering along with Dobby. I mean, it was a great speech, it was a great buildup, I thought.
Eric: But what about non-fans?
Andrew: I have yet to speak to them.
Richard: I still agree with Micah and I think that if the character was developed more, then I would have felt sadder when he did die.
Eric: I don’t think there is anything sadder than Harry holding the corpse of Dobby…
Eric: …and Luna coming and closing his eyes.
Micah: Not that.
Eric: I mean, that – and it looked…
Micah: Not that.
Micah: I’m talking about what takes place right before that. But…
Eric: So, you’re saying the rescue makes somehow less of an impact?
Micah: No, his speech! His speech was out of nowhere. All of a sudden he’s giving this – being a free house-elf. It felt fake to me. Sorry.
Andrew: All right.
Micah: …I’m the Simon Cowell of MuggleCast today.
Eric: No, no, no, it might be – okay, I think what you’re saying is Dobby talking about being a free elf has less meaning…
Micah: It does.
Eric: …because the freedom of elves has not been touched, because the freedom of elves and the independence of elves as a race has not been touched on at all in the films…
Micah: Right. No, you’re right.
Eric: …as it has in the books. I mean, I don’t think there are too many significant scenes where Dobby is between Book 2 and the rescue in Book 7. I mean, maybe following Draco around in Book 6 is the most important but that subplot was cut because he does it alone in that movie.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Trio at Malfoy Manor
Micah: Well, let’s talk a little bit more about Malfoy Manor. There was a scene, though, where – and I didn’t get this, maybe you can explain it because you guys know more about the making of the movies. But where that hair falls on Hermione when she is being tortured by Bellatrix.
Micah: What was that?
Andrew: The hair.
Eric: I don’t even know what that was.
Micah: There was…
Eric: Yeah, there was a hair and it wakes her up, she comes to.
Micah: Yeah, I didn’t get what that was. Maybe it was just…
Andrew: I don’t know. Maybe something to stir her. But that shot when Bellatrix is torturing Hermione was another stand-out moment in this film.
Eric: That was changed.
Andrew: You really connect with Hermione. What, was it shorter now?
Eric: It wasn’t just shorter. There was – okay, I’m going to be really quick but there’s a camera shot where we see what is on Hermione’s arm. But originally there was a scene – I guess because it was all one shot maybe of Bellatrix jumping on Hermione, torturing her, and then jumping or getting off Hermione, and Hermione looks – physically turns and holds her arm up to herself to read “Mudblood.” Instead Hermione is passed out and the camera shows “Mudblood” and then we show Hermione, and she is kind of immobilized and she has a tear in her eye like she can read it. But it is not the same scene that it was originally was and I think the reason was – we heard Yates and Heyman talk about the intensity, and Emma Watson talks about the intensity of her screaming and getting really into the moment. And I think that everybody was really afraid of showing too much, so a lot of that seems different or was cut.
Andrew: Or they’ll bump us to R.
Micah: Yeah, exactly.
Eric: But as long as you guys thought it was worthwhile then that’s cool.
Andrew: One other thing in Malfoy Manor here was Peter Pettigrew. I mean, there was a big change here where Pettigrew doesn’t kill himself. Harry shoots a spell at Pettigrew to knock him out while he has the fence – while he has the gate thing open because Harry and Ron were sort of hiding where Pettigrew couldn’t see them. I was disappointed that they changed this because I think Pettigrew’s silver hand registering, so to speak, the redemption, was a great part of the book.
Andrew: And it is – we do see it in Prisoner of Azkaban, so I don’t figure – I don’t know why they couldn’t have continued that plot line. I don’t – maybe they were fearing they would have had to have – they would have to remind the audience of what’s going on but that could have been solved with a couple of lines of dialogue, I thought.
Andrew: Or maybe it just broke from the pace of the – the pace that they were going for.
Eric: Yeah, because Harry was, like, “Hey. By the way, I saved your life one time. Now you need to – now you owe me one, buddy,” and then Wormtail hesitates. But then – I mean, I think seeing his own hand – strangled by your own hand is a great scene in the book because it’s so horrifying…
Eric: …and it would have been good in the film.
Eric: I wonder if they’re not going to really do the silver hand beats a werewolf thing because Pettigrew’s hand, even in the first Malfoy Manor scene when we see Pettigrew, Voldemort is chastising him for not taking care of Charity Burbage, not keeping her quiet. And he has his hand and it’s really out. And later he’s walking up the steps from the dungeon in Malfoy Manor, and his hand is hitting the wall and it’s clunking, heavy metal. I feel like they’re really building that up and obviously…
Andrew: So, maybe they’ll kill him in Part 2.
Eric: …it’ll come into play in Part 2.
Eric: Part 2, yeah.
Eric: They’re going to…
Andrew: I hope so.
Eric: Obviously, they have to.
Micah: I don’t think they will do it with Lupin, though. I think they stated that Lupin dies the same way that he does in the book and Harry just kind of sees him…
Micah: …sprawled out on the table when he goes into the Great Hall. But the other thing I can think of was they didn’t want to kill two people in a very short period of time. To kill Pettigrew and then…
Micah: …to kill Dobby right after that. Maybe it’s a little bit too much. Again, going – even taking the rating into consideration. I mean…
Andrew: I hope that’s not the reason, though, because I mean, what are they going to do with the battle? [laughs]
Micah: Yeah, that’s true.
Micah: That’s very true.
Andrew: In Part 2.
Eric: That’s a good point.
Micah: That’s a very good point.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: Dobby and Hedwig’s Deaths
Andrew: So, Dobby has his big speech. Like I said, in my theater, the fan theater at the premiere in New York, everyone ate that up. I mean, huge applause. And then, of course, the knife goes into Dobby and there is the scene where Dobby is being buried by Harry. Harry mentions he wants to do a proper burial, no wand work, which was good because that’s in the book, and we see him get buried. We don’t see his grave, though, the one that says, “Here Lies Dobby, A Free Elf.” But I think…
Eric: Part 2.
Andrew: Yeah, I think we’re going to see it in the beginning of Part 2 to refresh people’s memories. Maybe we will see another montage, sort of like what we got in the beginning of this film and – yeah, so I hope we do see that. I hope we do see that.
Andrew: Was everyone moved by Dobby’s death? Any tears? Richard Reed, did you cry?
Richard: I didn’t. I actually thought Hedwig’s death was sadder.
Andrew: Oh, we didn’t even talk about that.
Andrew: I mean, that was kind of a quick, quickie death.
Richard: I loved how she sacrificed herself for Harry.
Andrew: Yeah, that was good.
Eric: It beats the “Expelliarmus” line. Do we all agree that it beats the original way of dying, or not?
Eric: Are we too true to J.K. Rowling to say that?
Richard: I think the movie one was better, actually, yeah.
Micah: Well, speaking of that scene with the wands, obviously, were – did – was this similar to the book where Harry just grabs Draco’s wand and takes it away from him? Because that’s what happened in Malfoy Manor.
Richard: Yeah, that’s what he did.
Micah: It was a bit of a fight, though, wasn’t it? It was more of a fight than there was in the film.
Richard: In the book…
Micah: I thought…
Eric: Yeah, because he physically disarms him and that’s what transfers the allegiance of the Elder Wand, is that he disarms Draco and Draco had disarmed Dumbledore…
Micah: Right, right.
Eric: …the year previous. I don’t know. The allegiance of the Elder Wand is so hard to track. But yeah, it was basically that, so when he takes it from him physically, it seems like maybe that will have a different explanation in Part 2.
Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Review: End Scene
Andrew: And then, the big cliffhanger, we see Voldemort taking control of the Elder Wand. We again see Dumbledore’s tomb, which is still a very odd-looking tomb. I mean, like I mentioned…
Andrew: …when we first saw it in the trailer, it looks like a Jenga game and the blocks are sort of set up like they would in a Jenga puzzle. And they open up, Voldemort cracks his – cracks the tomb, which was cool, and then we see Voldemort go right in, face-to-face with Dumbledore, takes control of the Elder Wand, sends the spell up into the sky, and end scene. Credits. Fin. See you at Part 2. There was no teaser for Part 2. I was kind of hoping for a sort of little teaser thing or something.
Andrew: That would have been a nice touch, I thought.
Eric: Like at the end of Back to the Future? [laughs] Where they do that – first scenes?
Andrew: I haven’t seen that.
Micah: No surprise here, though, I thought the ending was a little anti-climactic. I thought…
Andrew: Maybe because you expect…
Eric: Why does everybody say that?
Andrew: Yeah, everybody – nobody was really blown away by…
Micah: Because there was no energy! There was no sense of – if Harry would have said – if there would have been a quick shot to Harry saying, “He has the Elder Wand,” and then back to Voldemort casting into the – there was no real feeling of foreboding at the end. It was just kind of, oh, shot the spell in the air! Movie’s over.
Richard: Yeah, exactly.
Micah: And they should – they could have done a lot more with that cut-scene, especially since I think they split it at the right point. They just didn’t – they didn’t drive it home the right way.
Andrew: Richard, where do you think it should have been placed?
Richard: The split?
Andrew: The split, yeah.
Richard: Well, I think if I had my way I would have had the split as they got caught by the Snatchers and then I would have left Malfoy Manor for the last film. I mean, considering how much content – I mean, this film was really two-thirds of the book. It wasn’t really half of the book, and that’s so much content that they could have gone into that I’m worried that the next film is going to be all action, no story. And this film was kind of – it was almost the opposite, but I wasn’t convinced by the story.
Favorites: Deathly Hallows: Part 1 Edition
Andrew: All right, we’re very far into the show. Obviously, there is still a lot more to discuss, but that sums up the major scenes and we will definitely talk more about everything in future episodes. For now though, we’re going to do a couple of quick questions. We’re just going to go around the table, give some quick answers. First question: favorite new character? Eric Scull, go.
Eric: Reg Cattermole.
Andrew: My answer is Runcorn, too. Favorite scene, Eric?
Eric: The Three – no, I’m not going to say The Three Brothers…
Eric: …because that isn’t acting. It doesn’t take any kind of acting. I’m going to say still the Horcrux scene.
Micah: The Ministry.
Richard: The Obliviate at the start.
Andrew: I – mine was the – [sighs] I hate to – I can’t pick one Malfoy Manor scene. I’m just going to say Malfoy Manor in general. Those were great. Least favorite scene, Eric?
Eric: Hmm, don’t go to me first.
Andrew: [laughs] Micah?
Micah: Well, where should I start?
Micah: No, no, I’m just kidding.
Andrew: One that really bugs you.
Eric: Superlative, Micah. Superlative.
Andrew: If you could pick one that had to be changed.
Micah: One that had to be changed. Oh man…
Eric: Yeah, be Warner Bros. Be, like, “Hey, this needs more reshoots in December.”
Eric: What would you…
Micah: Oh man, I would say probably…
Richard: This is like a Rupert Grint interview.
Micah: Yeah. [laughs]
Micah: Yeah, no, it’s hard.
Micah: It’s hard because we’ve talked about so much here.
Eric: Poor Richard.
Andrew: How about you, Richard, while we’re waiting for the other two?
Richard: I hated the Harry/Hermione dance scene so much.
Andrew: Oh my goodness!
Richard: It just felt wrong on many levels…
Andrew: Why? What bothered you about it?
Richard: …that they were trying to imply that those two might kiss.
Andrew: Well, I agree with that, but that didn’t bother me.
Micah: I would say the pacing of the forest scenes. If they could have quickened the pace of the forest scenes, I think I would do that.
Andrew: Yeah, you know what? I have the same answer as you. I don’t know how, though, but – because there is a lot of information going on there, particularly Harry and Ron fight, Ron returning, the destroying of the Horcrux. I mean, those were big things. But yeah, I think they could have tuned that up a little bit, if they had to change that. And Eric?
Eric: It almost seems like they would have to be less faithful to the book if they were going to quicken the pace any further in the forest.
Andrew: I know, yeah. But what’s your…
Eric: Least favorite scene?
Eric: The scene on the train that takes place on the Hogwarts Express.
Micah: Oh yeah.
Eric: There’s this great moment where Neville is, like, “Harry is not here.” And he says it like he’s – it’s supposed to sound defeated, like even he is upset that Harry is not with them.
Andrew: Well, Neville…
Eric: But it’s so short.
Andrew: …calls him stupid, too.
Eric: Yeah, yeah. “Hey, losers.”
Andrew: I couldn’t…
Eric: “Hey, losers.”
Andrew: Oh, right. Yeah, what – I didn’t get that.
Eric: “He’s not here.”
Eric: But there is so much – it’s a second, it’s really a second. There is nothing to it, so I hated – that’s my least favorite scene because why even film it when – I even felt that Matt Lewis’s acting was trying to tell me something.
Andrew: Well, in a way, it gets back to…
Eric: And the timing that the film – yeah.
Andrew: It gets back to explaining…
Eric: Gave it…
Andrew: It gets back to explaining why – to helping explain that people are looking for Harry. That’s why they are…
Andrew: …on the run. Micah, I think you were saying earlier…
Eric: Right, but how do Harry’s friends feel about him being missing is what I was interested in…
Eric: …and I felt like that was about – going to be what that scene was about because even Cormac McLaggen is in this film for that [snaps fingers] split second…
Andrew: [laughs] Right.
Eric: …where he’s, like, “My father will be hearing about this.” But it’s so short that it’s my least favorite scene because it – you almost can’t even take in what does happen and not to mention what doesn’t, and should, happen. It’s what does happen is so quick.
Andrew: That got a lot of laughs, though.
Micah: What were you saying, though, Andrew? You…
Andrew: Well, you had mentioned earlier that there was no – I think it was you. You mentioned that there was no explanation of why they were on the run. I mean, this sort of explains – this helps explain why they are on the run because they are being looked for even on the Hogwarts Express. So, it helps explain to the viewer why they are not going to Hogwarts.
Micah: Well, I think…
Andrew: It’s not the best, no.
Micah: No, no, I think my point was just – the severity of the situation is undermined a bit because you don’t get as much of a look into how threatening Voldemort is to not just the wizarding world, but the Muggle world as well.
Listener Tweets: Deathly Hallows: Part 1
Andrew: Let’s now get into some listener tweets on Part 1. We asked you to send these in if you follow us on Twitter and our Twitter name – our Twitter URL is Twitter.com/MuggleCast.
“Some parts sucked, some parts were awesome. The Seven Potters was just too funny for me. Hedwig’s death was awful.”
“I watched the seventh movie and found it amazing. By the way, our favorite scene was when Harry and Hermione danced, and when Ron kissed that man’s wife.”
“The film is definitely the best so far. Wasn’t sure about the start with the Minister of Magic, but loved the creative animation.”
Anorexorcist13 wrote – you guys have some crazy Twitter names, by the way:
“I loved ‘DH Part 1’, although Grindelwald gave Dumbledore up too easily when Voldemort came looking for the wand.”
“Six out of ten for blazing fast pace, episodic feeling, par acting, but great aesthetics far superior to all previous ‘Potter’ films.”
Yeah, the on-location stuff was great. I mean, some of the – when they were camping, there were some beautiful areas they were walking around.
Eric: Andrew, can you talk about J.K. Rowling being a producer? Did they mention that at the junket? I heard it got kind of a non…
Andrew: They said there was no difference. It’s what she’s always done, she’s just actually credited as a producer.
Eric: All right.
Andrew: DarkWolf312 wrote:
“Why didn’t they show Bellatrix using ‘Crucio’? Some people thought she was biting Hermione’s arm, initially.”
[Andrew and Eric laugh]
Andrew: LultimaNotte said:
“First time I left an ‘HP’ movie without feeling disappointed. I love it!”
“I thought the overall movie was great, but I hate that they left out the Dudley/Harry part. The Three Brothers part excellent though.”
“I loved it, best adaptation so far. I loved that they included a lot of dialogue from the book, but why is Wormtail still alive?!”
Eric: That’s the question, isn’t it?
Andrew: Hopefully in Part 2, we’ll get an answer.
Eric: I feel like they had to do something so jarring that everybody is talking about it and is going to go see Part 2 to find out why Wormtail is still alive.
[Andrew and Richard laugh]
Eric: They might even do…
Andrew: That’s the big cliffhanger.
Eric: They might even do Deathly Hallows: Part 2 posters of just Wormtail…
Eric: …with the silver hand going, “I’m still alive!”
Richard: That’s the hook for the next film.
Eric: You think so?
Andrew: ItsLaurenYvonne wrote:
“The film felt like a different entity in itself. I kind of can’t imagine seeing ‘6’ then moving to that but not a bad thing! Loved it.”
“Surprisingly faithful to the book. The cliffhanger was deliciously cruel. Kloves is a closet Harry/Hermione shipper.”
[laughs] That’s the answer to that. He totally is.
Andrew: Maria Natera wrote:
“Hi from Venezuela! Loved the movie, some lines were exactly from the book! Didn’t like that they left out Kreacher’s story.”
And finally, Dreyesbo wrote:
“If this was the exposition movie and ‘Part 2’ the action, I feel the audience is still missing crucial info.”
This was definitely not the exposition movie because David Yates said they cut out everything that was exposition, [laughs] so…
Andrew: So, that’s our big movie review episode. Obviously, there was a lot to talk about and we hoped you enjoyed this discussion but this is, of course, not the end of our discussion on this movie. We will be talking about it for many episodes to come. And I’m sure lots of you have feedback about what we had to say today, so to send it in, please do visit MuggleCast.com, then click on “Contact” at the top, and from there you can fill out our feedback form and give us your thoughts, whether you disagreed or agreed with anything we had to say, and we cannot wait to read your e-mails and get some of them on the next show.
Micah: I think we had a healthy difference of opinion on a lot of things.
Andrew: Yeah, that’s good.
Micah: Might be the first time in a while that’s actually happened.
Andrew: Speaking of e-mails, on Episode 213 we asked for weird places that you have listened to MuggleCast. We got lots of answers and they have been a lot of fun to read, so thanks everyone for sending them in. We ran out of time on this episode, but we will definitely read them on Episode 215. And finally, one last reminder: if you’re listening to this on Saturday, November 20th or Sunday, November 21st, the nomination period for the 2010 Podcast Awards ends on Sunday, November 21st. Just go to MuggleCast.com and at the top of the page right above our Twitter box, you will see – or right above the pumpkins, you will see very easy instructions on how to nominate us. We appreciate that very much and hopefully next month we will learn that we have been nominated…
Andrew: …in the 2010 Podcast Awards.
Micah: So, can I ask one last question here before we go? If you had to rate this movie, just a number out of 10, what would it be?
Andrew: I would give it an 8, but I fully anticipate giving Part 2 a 10.
Eric: Oh, that seems like a good double question: What would you rate Part 1 and what do you expect you will rate Part 2, given where you think they are going?
Eric: Are you worried?
Richard: I would give Part 1 a 3, maybe a 4, purely for Emma Watson.
Richard: Part 2…
Andrew: Well, what…
Richard: I kind of hope it’s really – I’m kind of expecting it to be awesome and if it is, then I will gladly give it a 10. I mean, I want to give this film a 10, but I just can’t.
Andrew: You can’t even give it half of 10. [laughs] And Eric, your answer?
[Show music begins]
Eric: I’m going to give Part 1 a 10 and I’m only going to expect a 7 out of Part 2.
Eric: I feel like – just in general, I feel like this was the film that’s going to connect with me the most for some reason, whatever reason.
Micah: I give this movie 6 out of 10.
Andrew: All right, there we go. Thanks everyone for listening! It’s been a lot of fun. Again, our next episode will have much more. We barely scratched the surface talking about this film, so we will be back soon. Thanks everyone for listening! I’m Andrew Sims.
Eric: I’m Eric Scull.
Micah: I’m Micah Tannenbaum.
Richard: And I’m Richard Reid.
Andrew: We’ll see you next time for Episode 215, where we will have Part Two of our Part 1 discussion. Haha, see what I did there?
Micah: Yeah, that was pretty clever.
Andrew: [laughs] Bye.
Micah: Not really. Bye.
[Show music continues]